Adiyen,

Swami has clarified the purpose of dharma sandeha in today’s audio #758 Do I have 49 births?

We shall ask questions in dharma sandeha and Swami will answer EnPani.

In previous EnPaNi Swami asked to listen more and lessen writing. So am going to reduce any urge to responsd just post question & wait for answer if possible.

There will be answers from multiple perspectives but Velukkudi Swamy’s answer will be final as this forum is dedicated for this purpose.

Yes I have to do justice and not mix things here.

Hope adiyen made sense

Dasanudasan

Sri ‘RamAnuja’ Munaye Namaha,

(‘SriRama’ Bhagavanukku ‘Anujan’ (brother) Aaga irukkum ‘Lakshmanan’ (AadhiSheshan) yendru Azhaikka padum Swami ‘RamaAnuja’ Muniyai Vanangukiraen)
‘SriRama’nukku ‘Anujan’ = ‘RamAnujan’.

Dear Bakthas,

Wonderful. Great.

Sri Velukkudi Krishnan Swami Yellarudaya Manadhayum Aandananaey,
Sarvam SriKrishna Kudumbham.

Adiyen ramanuja dasan

adiyen swamin,

what is the differenCe between acharyan and swayamacharyan?? Will the  swayama

charyan comes under 74 disciples of Sri ramanujar.why they are as swayamacharyan??

Adiyen ramanuja dasan.

adiyen want to know the difference between acharyan and swamacharyan??will swayamacharyan comes under 74 disciples of sri ramanujar?why they are named as swayamacharyan???

Adiyen dasan 

Adiyen ramanuja dasan.

adiyen want to know the difference between acharyan and swamacharyan??will swayamacharyan comes under 74 disciples of sri ramanujar?why they are named as swayamacharyan???

Adiyen dasan 

Adiyen ramanuja dasan

adiyen swamin,

what is the differenCe between acharyan and swayamacharyan?? Will the  swayama

charyan comes under 74 disciples of Sri ramanujar.why they are as swayamacharyan??

Sri Ramanuja Munaye Namaha,

Sri Dasarathiye Namaha,

Sri Velukkdi Krishnan Swami Guruvae Namaha,

Dear Baktha,

Beautiful thought process by posting the question in a fresh title, so a new question doesn’t get buried or unnoticed under existing threads. Very nice thinking.

******************************************************************************

Dear Alarmelmangai Baktha,

For future, as the Baktha has said, please post the question in a new title in the Dharma Sandeha.

Here are some links on different threads, where few Bakthas explain how to post a ‘new’ question in the Title and we can get answer from Sri Velukkudi Krishnan Swami.

https://www.kinchit.org/dharma-sandeha/thread/why-unlimited-number-of-sthavara-as-well-as-HYPERLINK “https://www.kinchit.org/dharma-sandeha/thread/why-unlimited-number-of-sthavara-as-well-as-jangama-as-compared-to-manusyas/”jHYPERLINK “https://www.kinchit.org/dharma-sandeha/thread/why-unlimited-number-of-sthavara-as-well-as-jangama-as-compared-to-manusyas/”angama-as-compared-to-manusyas/

https://www.kinchit.org/dharma-sandeha/thread/dharma-sandeha-createposting-a-question/

https://www.kinchit.org/dharma-sandeha/thread/acharya-devo-bhava/

Hope this helps.

******************************************************************************

Meantime Sri Velukkudi Swami answers Baktha’s question: “adiyen want to know the difference between acharyan and swamacharyan??will swayamacharyan comes under 74 disciples of sri ramanujar?why they are named as swayamacharyan???”,

For adiyen’s understanding about the question, adiyen would like to understand what is “swayamacharyan”. Does it mean “Swathanthra Acharyan (Self proclaimed or Independent Acharyan)”.

If so, adiyen would like to SHARE Sri Velukkudi Swami’s “existing” audios as well as upanyasams/discourses related to this question as best as possible which is the PRAMAANAM for adiyen. Hope, Swami’s existing audios/upanyasams answers Baktha’s question.

Here we go.

<Enpani #473 “Self Styled and Parampara Acharya” with additional reference from Swami’s Upanyasams>

Swami says, there are two types of Gurus or Acharyas.

1) Self Styled Acharyan (Swathanthran Acharya or “Independent Acharya”) : Who has acquired spiritual knowledge by “SELF READING” or Suddenly with BhagavAn’s blessings.

* This type of Acharya’s DOESN’T have a GuruParamparai (NO lineage of Spiritual Preceptors “Before and After” them).

* They self proclaim to be the first Acharyan.

2) Parampara Acharyan (PARATHANTRAN Acharya or “Dependent Acharya”) : Who has acquired/learned Spiritual knowledge by “SERVING” to HIS Acharyan with BhagavAn’s blessings due to “Guru-Bakthi”.

* This type of Acharya’s DOES have a GuruParamparai (Lineage of Spiritual Preceptors “Before and After” them).

* They don’t self proclaim as the 1st Acharyan.

#######################

Since “Swathantra Acharyas” have not “Served” their Acharya, as they didnot have one, such Acharyas will have “LESS or NO” attitude towards Serving BhagavAn, since they don’t know what is “Serving” means. They will only keep reading and preaching spiritual knowledge “WITHOUT Servitude”. This is AGAINST JeevAthma Swaroopam, since a JeevAthma is suppose to serve (KAINKARYAM) BhagavAn-Thayar and HIS favorites Alwars, Acharyas and Bhagavatas.

[So Bkathas/Devotees to abstain from such self-proclaimed, self-styled Swathanthra Gurus due to “no good” for their own JeevAthma Swaroopam. We can see lot of examples in our present life itself. Those Guru’s get into trouble and their followers as well].

But “Parathathran Acharyas (Parampara Acharyas)” do “Service” to their Acharyas for long period of time with panivu/thanadakkam in-line with Shastra Maargam to get ‘meaning’ of each shastra vaakyam inorder for them to FOLLOW and PREACH. Then at one point, based on their Acharya Krupai, they get the Spiritual Knowledge from their Acharyan who inturn got that Spiritual knowledge by serving their own Acharyan and this chain reaction ladder goes upwards till BhagavAn SriKrishna. This type of Acharyas are also called as “ANUVRITTHI PrasannAcharyas (keep serving then keep getting spiritual knowledge for them to FOLLOW)”. This type of “Servitude” thinking is the correct Jeevathma Swaroopam (Kainakryam, kainkaryam, kainkaryam……).

List of few “Parathanthran Acharyas (Parampara Acharyas)” as Swami says in Enpani #473 are as follows:

1) Vedas Vyasar

2) Ramanujar

3) Shankarar

4) Madhvar

5) Chaitanyar

6) Vallabhar

7) Nimbhar

8) Ramanandhar.

etc……

#######################

Regarding “74 Acharyas disciples of Swami Ramanujar”:

Since Swami Ramanujar is a “Parathanthran Acharyan” (Parampara Acharyan who has Before & After preceprtos), HIS 74 disciple lineages are also Parathanthran Acharyas and NOT self-styled or Swathanthra or Swayam Acharyas.

When Swami Ramanujar did Sharanagathy to Louts Feet of BhagavAn NamPerumal (SriRama) and Piratti Thayar during Panguni Utthiram, NamPArumal has said HE will give Moksham to Swami Ramanujar. Addtionally with Swami Ramanujar’s Irakkam on other suffering JeevAthmas, Swami asked further to Perumal and Piratti to “GIVE MOKSHAM SriVaikunta Praapthi” for HIS Sambhandhis as well for Nithya Kainkaryam. NamPerumal and Piratti sanctioned Swami’s Vinnappam. So, inorder to establish the Ramanujar Sambhandham, Swami has initiated the 74 Acharya lineages.

So by doing Pancha Samskaram, we get Ramanuja Sambhandham in the name of Sharanagathy, because Sharanagathy itself is dificult to do. Only Mahans like Swami Ramanujar can do Sharanagathy. So we go and do Pancha Samskaram to get Ramanuja Sambhandham in the name of Sharanagathy, so we reach Moksham in same birth for Nithya Kainkaryam.

Below 1),2) 3) form one set of the 74 lineages. Like that, that there are 74 acharya lineages. Each of the the 74 Acharya lineages itself is a big tree and each tree of 74 Acharya lineages merge to 4) Swami Ramanujar Sambhandham.

Like MudhaliAandan, KoorthAzhvan, Embar, Kidambi Aachan etc… are each Acharyas intiated by Swami Ramanujar to form a total of 74 Acharya lineages. So we got ot any of these 74 Acharya lineages to get the Ramanuja Sambhandham and the get the blessings of Guru-Paramparai and reach Moksham SriVaikuntam (Releived from “Karma-Janma-Jananam”) for Nithya Kainkaryam.

After Ramanujar Avatram, the 74 Acharya lineages 3),2),1) are KRUPA MAATRA PrasannAcharyas and not ANUVRITTHI PrasannAcharyas., since We go and show our helplessness to reach Moksham and We Accept that we are Perumal Sotthu. Based on ACHARYA KRUPA KATAKSHAM, they don’t test us like AnuVritthi PrasannAcharyas and recommend to Swami Ramanujar for our Moksham and Nithya Kainkaryam.

Here is the GURU-PARAMPARAI sequence from ‘Present Acharyan’ till ‘BhagavAn’.

1) Asmad Gurubhyo Namaha (Present Acharyan)

2) Asmad Parama Gurubhyo Namaha (His immediate Acharyan)

3) Asmad Sarva Gurubhyo Namaha (All Acharyas in between 2) &3))

4) Srimatae Ramanujaya Namaha (Uddharaka Acharyan who lifts us to cross this Samsaram)

5) Sri Paraankusa Dasaaya Namaha (Swami Periya Nambi)

6) Srimad Yamuna Munaye Namaha (Swami Alavandar)

7) Sri Rama Mishraya Namaha (Swami Manakkaal Nambi)

8) Sri Pundarikaashaya Namaha (Swami Uyyakondar)

9) Sriman NaathaMuniye Namaha (Swami NaathamunigAl)

10) Srimatae SadaGopaye Namaha (Swami NamAlwar)

11) Srimatae Vishvak Senaye Namaha (Nithya Soori “Senai Mudhaliyar”)

12) Sriyai Namaha (Sri MahaLakshmi Piratti)

13) Sridharayai Namaha (BhagavAn Sriman Narayanan “GeethAcharyan” SriKrishna).

References:

Sri Velukkudi Swami says these in Enpani # 734 “Where to Do Samasrayana”; “Ramanuja Vaibhavam” upanyasam and “GuruParamparai” upanyasam. Also available in 2017 kinchit calender CD.

Adiyen Sri Velukkudi Krishna Dasan,

Adiyen Acharya Dasan,

Adiyen Ramanuja Dasan,

Uyya Oraey VAzhi UdayavAr ThiruvAdi,

Chella Pillai Yathiraja Sampath Kumar SriKrishna BhagavAn ki Jai.

Sri:

Enpani #473 “Self Styled and Parampara Acharya” with additional reference from Swami’s Upanyasams.

@KongilPiraati mathAji

Please do not refer these as self styled AchAryan. They have a family lineage under Guru Parampara.

It shouldn’t become an apachAram so intervening. It’s more of a sampradhAyic question Adiyen beleive.

Let’s not refer previous EnPaNi audios for this Question Velukkudi Swamy has not answered in that context in that audio with reference to swayamAchArya.

Apologies if adiyen said anything wrong

Dasanudasan

Srimatae Ramanujaya Namaha,

Dear Bhaktha,

Please be specific about Baktha’s statement as

“Please do not refer these as self styled AchAryan.”

What does “these” mean. 

Whom did adiyen mention as “self styled Acharyas”. Adiyen already mentioned the list of ‘Parampara Acharyas’ from Swami’s Enpani #473 in the above thread.

Prampara Acharyas means, they gave their own GURU-PARAMPARAI for all those in the above the list as Swami says in Enpani #473.

Regarding 74 Acharya lineages, adiyen mentioned the specific Guru-Paramparai of “Before & After” of Swami Ramanujar for those who want to get Ramanuja Sambhandham to go Moksham in same birth as per Swami’s audios and upanyasams.

That doesn’t mean other Parampara Acharyas doesn’t have their own GuruParamparai. They gave their own Guru-Paramparai. That’s why all those Acharyas in the list as Swami mentions in Enpani #473 are called Paramparai Acharyas and not Self-styled Acharyas.

So, Adiyen will re-list again from the above thread about the Parampara Acharyas ( means with respectable Guru-Paramparai of their own).

[List of few “Parathanthran Acharyas (Parampara Acharyas)” as Swami says in Enpani #473 are as follows:

1) Vedas Vyasar

2) Ramanujar

3) Shankarar

4) Madhvar

5) Chaitanyar

6) Vallabhar

7) Nimbhar

8) Ramanandhar.

etc……]

Adiyen is only referencing from Swami’s audios and discourses.

There is “no list” that adiyen provided for Self-styled Acharyas, since Swami didnot mention any list in Enpani #473.

so where is the question of
“Please do not refer these as self styled AchAryan”.

Baktha kindly don’t confuse adiyen.
Sorry to all Baktha’s, for any confusion.

Sri Velukkudi Krishnan Swami Yellarudaya Manadhayum Aandananaey.
Loka Samastha Sukhino BhavAnthu
Sarvam SriKrishna Kudumbham.

Please clarify my doubt.

If Hinduism is millions of years old, then how come other religion formed inbetween? Why Lord Krishna or Rama didn’t travel in Jerusalem and Arab or other religious countries. Is Christian-ism and Islamism are branches of the root Hindu tree?