Dear Swamy/periyava,
Adiyen ramanujadasan
When one srivashnavan stays in abroad when he expects to follow the tradition, but son of soil who seeing us will think that why he follow his tradition in our country? . Is this question expected if so how to handle that situation.
Should that abroad staying srivashnavan limit himself on public or he should restrict visiting public areas?
Jai shri Ram
Adiyen ramanujadasan
Swami, it depends on the country / place and the social understanding there combined with safety setup. But if safety is not an issue, then it’s totally up to the individual’s state of mind on the extent to follow the tradition. As long as the practice doesn’t hurt or interfere with others basic rights, it should be fine. The best part is that our Sri Vaishnava Sampradaya without hurting, embraces everyone as we are all of part of Sriman Narayana regardless of caste, creed or nationality. If a Sikh, Muslim, Jew or a Christian doesn’t feel bad in displaying / practicing publicly who they are, why should we feel different to wear thiruman or veshti and go out in public?
adiyen follows best to this principle as simple as making sure to wear at least Sri Churnam to go to office meetings and wear veshti whenever possible. Hope this helps.
adiyen,
Ramanuja dasan.
Many thanks swmai for your sharing
How it differs for location like. Dubai, Saudi, Rome, Turkey , how we should react or practice. Don’t mistake me for this question
Swami, when it comes to following our tradition outside of India, adiyen take a lot inspiration from Gaudiya Vaishnavas (esp. ISKCON). Recently ISKCON has been able to convince the Chinese government to publish a version of Bhagavad Gita from the government’s official press. We all know how China controls what gets public. BAPS is constructing a massive temple in one of the most conservative places, Abu Dhabi. Adiyen have visited many ISKCON temples in US and in interesting places like Guadalajara, Honolulu, Tokyo, Brussels and Munich and was amazed to see how deeply the locals are following our Sanatana Dharma. So basically it’s all in us on how we are expressing ourselves without hurting others. Once a westerner asked me in a store here in US, what’s the red mark on your face and adiyen replied it’s represents that adiyen is the servant of my eternal mother. He got interested by the word “eternal” and asked me more. Towards the end, he asked, is there qualification required and adiyen said to call your mother, “Mother”, as there no qualification required similarly we just have to accept that She is our eternal mother and no qualification is required. When our actions root from the cause of true love considering the fact that everybody are His children, majority of the times it results in a positive experience. When adiyen was visiting Mormon’s Mecca in Salt Lake City, the sisters who came to guide me the temple were sharing with me the greatness of their religion and practices and without hurting them adiyen shared how our santana dharma has answers to questions even beyond heaven and they appreciated it. So Acharya anugraham that leads to our strong determination, can certainly help us practice our dharma wherever we are. Hope this helps.
adiyen,
Ramanuja Dasan.
Lovely sharing brings more strength Swamy. Bagvathas discussion is awesome
Srimathe Rangaramanuja Mahadesikaya Namaha
@Govinda Narayanan Swamy
Practicing within house is okay. Be careful with public display in abroad.
My sis told, in Abudhabi, one person took aarati on terrace, neighbours called police and he got arrested.
Within home is okay don’t take risk in public display.
Enakku neer dhan mukhiyam perumalai vida .
Dasanudasan
Badri swamy,
adiyen is the servant of my eternal mother.
to call your mother, “Mother”, as there no qualification required similarly we just have to accept that She is our eternal mother and no qualification is required
stunning explanation.
adiyen
Very nice Abroad experience shared by Swami ! Now I have more clarity . Adiyen ramanujadasan
Srimathe Rangaramanuja Mahadesikaya Namaha
Srimathe Sri Varaha Mahadesikaya Namaha
Sri Velukkudi Krishnan Swamy Thiruvadigaley Sharanam
Sri:
What will we think of Church & Mosque? So their thought is correct.
We should avoid public display and getting into conflict in abroad. After coming to India Jollya PerumALA sevikkalam 😁
Dasanudasan
Swamy, are you sure ?. any of our periyavas travel to Abroad do you suggest this too ?
@Badri Narayanan Swamy
Enna voi SriVaishnavam conversion pandreera? “we just have to accept that She is our eternal mother and no qualification is required”
You should have told, “Even if you don’t accept She is your mother”
Dasanudasan
Srimathe Rangaramanuja Mahadesikaya Namaha
Srimathe Sri Varaha Mahadesikaya Namaha
Sri Velukkudi Krishnan Swamy Thiruvadigaley Sharanam
Sri:
We all are Sri RAmAnujA Followers
What did our Acharya do for bad king Kirmi Kanda Cholan? Left the place..
Are we happy koorathAzhwan losing sight?
Just rewind you will get answer. We are a SAthvik community.
Comparison with Iskcon is unnecessary. Gaudiya Vaishnavas blah blah.
They do what their Acharyan told , we do what our Acharyan said. That’s it
Veera vilaiyaattu konjam stop pannittu, Perumal kapathuvara nu perumaalaye TEST pandratha vittutu kaatiya vazhiyil nadappom.
Dasanudasan
Leave the place is your suggestion swamy ?. How many of us leave when there is an need to stay abroad and willing to continue bhakti tooo… its a question not for me. in general thought came and asked…..
Veera vilaiyaattu konjam stop pannittu, Perumal kapathuvara nu perumaalaye TEST pandratha vittutu kaatiya vazhiyil nadappom.
“காட்டிய வழி” என்று தாங்கள் குறிப்பிடுவது எது ஸ்வாமி?
நம் வேளுக்குடி க்ருஷ்ணன் ஸ்வாமி வெளி நாடுகள் பயணிக்கும் போது காட்டிய வழி எது?
பத்ரி ஸ்வாமியில் பதிவில் “தன் வீரத்தை காட்டிகொள்வதற்காக” என்று பொருள் உணர்த்தும் படி ஏதும் இல்லையே! தாங்கள் எதை குறிப்பிடுகிறீர்?
பத்ரி ஸ்வாமி வலிய போய் நாலு பேரிடம் சனாதன மதத்தை பற்றி பேசியிருந்தால் தாங்கள் ‘proselytising’ என்று சொல்லாம். அவரோ ஆர்வத்துடன் வினவியவருக்கு அருமையான, ஆழமான, நேர்த்தியான பதில் அளித்திருக்கிறார். ஆர்வமுள்ளவர் அனைவருக்கும் திருமந்திரம் அளிக்கும் தகுதி அவருக்கு இல்லாமல் போகலாம். ஆனால் ஆர்வமுள்ள அனைவருக்கும் சனாதன மதத்தின் அடிப்படை தத்துவத்தை விளக்குவதில் தவறு ஏதும் இல்லையே!
I am not convinced your interpretation of Badri-swamy’s post, and your expressions on the same are correct.
adiyen dasan.
Namaskaram Vikram Swamy,
adiyen has a lot of respect for you. This group is under the guidance of our Sri Velukkudi Swamigal, who never demeans any sampradaya. In all his lectures, our Swami talks great about all sampradaya acharyas. Cheap words such as “Gaudiya Vaishnavas blah blah” are not elegant for a great soul like devareer. Devareer is also belittling great service carried by great souls and acharyas such as our Swami, Sri Chinna Jeeyar Swami, Srila Prabhupada, many other jeeyars / acharyas, and all the millions of devotees, who are selflessly spreading Sanatana dharma across the world. World leaders such as the US president have started celebrating Deepavali publicly in their official residences. Please listen carefully to the culture upanyasam delivered by our Swami on 20th Nov 2021 for a better understanding. As the age progresses, great enlightened souls like our Swami make changes to spread the teachings of our sastras. This includes traveling across the world in their traditional attire and outfit. Haven’t devareer seen our swami without tiruman or veshti in public displays when he is outside India? Haven’t devareer seen the Jagannath rath yatra procession publicly held in many countries across the world? Haven’t devareer been to temples, which have become landmarks in those cities outside India? Haven’t devareer come across global major media promoting the greatness of our Sanatana dharma? Haven’t devareer heard of the world’s top universities opening chapters in their respective universities on our Sanatana dharma? Haven’t devareer heard about great souls outside India, who have translated our scriptures and digitized them? adiyen can go forever. Please open up your eyes and start appreciating the great work that’s being done to our Sanatana dharma across the globe and a kind suggestion, please avoid demeaning statements that will hurt other jeevatmas and remember the verse
அமர ஓர் அங்கம் ஆறும் வேதம் ஓர் நான்கும் ஓதித்
தமர்களிற் தலைவராய சாதி-அந்தணர்களேலும்
நுமர்களைப் பழிப்பர் ஆகில் நொடிப்பது ஓர் அளவில் ஆங்கே
அவர்கள்தாம் புலையர் போலும் அரங்க மா நகருளானே
adiyen don’t mind devareer blaspheming me. But adiyen’s worry is that adiyen shouldn’t be a cause for a good soul like devareer’s downfall.
தவறு இருந்தால் க்ஷிமிக்க பிரார்த்திக்கிறேன்.
adiyen,
Badrinarayana Ramauja Dasan.
@Vikram Swami: Please listen to our Swami’s recent upanyasam of Srimad Bhagavatham part 017, 1st Canto Chapter 4&5 Part 2, time 9:40. straight forward answer to this question.
Swamy Purushan Purushottaman
Avar dhariyama iruppar , avar ashirvadham irundhal, dhairiyam varum. So please proceed. Guru Ashirvadham nothing stopping.
Just one doubt, why udayavar did not face the situation? Kirmi Kanda Cholana directa confront panni irukkalAmey!
koorathAzhwan “YAm Petra vaazhvu naalooraanum Peruga” nu sonnaar
Naama yethana per appadi solla pakkuvam irukku?
Dasanudasan
I went to Abu Dhabi once during 20Yrs-30yrs.
Thiruman ettundu veliya pogadha nu bayamuruthina.
Pongada neengalum unga Abu Dhabiyum nu 5 days la thirumbi vandhutten.
Sethu snanam pannittu ini foreign poga pdathu nu mudivula irukken.
Ippa kuda Qatar po ngra na mudiyadhu nutten.
Desktop la kozhandha padam vechirundha othukara
Perumal padam vechirundha “it may hurt client’s religious sentiments please remove” ngra
Avan oorukku naan yen poganum? Ellam ingerndhey pannuvom appavum computer work aagum
What’s the value of a place even if it’s heaven without freedom?
Adhey samayam I don’t think there is any value in staying with uncomfortable people who doesn’t hone sath sangam.
Dasanudasan
Emperumaanar went to Thirunarayanapuram not fearing the king. It was to retrieve chella pillai
Seri Swamy,
Adiyen heard differently from Krishna Premi Swamigal. Emperumanar Vella veshti dharithar nu kadhai kaeten adhan Inga kaeten. Edhu unmai sambhavam nu eppudi therinjukardhu?
Still, fear la enna thavaru irukku? Swamy Desikan muslimku bayandhu odalaya?
Safeguarding sampradayam is the core , our reaction in such situations need not be weighed I guess.
Emperumanar sAthvikamAnavar avar bayandhu pona enna thavaru irukkiradhu?
Dasanudasan
Vikram swamy,
your concern is very clearly addressed by Badri swamy right at the beginning of his first reply:
Swami, it depends on the country / place and the social understanding there combined with safety setup. But if safety is not an issue, then it’s totally up to the individual’s state of mind on the extent to follow the tradition. As long as the practice doesn’t hurt or interfere with others basic rights, it should be fine.
adiyen dasan.
Let me stop here Swamy. I don’t see any value in such generic discussions. Vazha Vazha kozha kozha. Venumna follow Pannu illati vendAm nu soldrathu eppadi conclusive discussion?
Thiruman ettundu dhan poganum
தலை அறுப்புண்டும் சாகேன் (Thondaradipodi Azhwaar)
Gamers idha “God Mode” nu solluvaa
Illa
நாயேன் வந்து அடைந்தேன் (திருமங்கையாழ்வார்)
Sensitive mode
Both are different emotions altogether
Dasanudasan
I strongly feel
Namma sampradhayathula ellathukkum reasoning irukku.
What approach Swamy Desikan took on each challenge?
How he countered the snake 🐍 charmer?
How he countered the Kerala Mantravaadi ?
How he softly dealt a Sri Vaishnavite in Paduka Sahasram challenge
How he created a well & statue by countering a scultptor
How he faced Muslim invasion
Idho I am 40yrs now. If I don’t research this, there is no point in me living
Dasanudasan
As far as I understand, Swamy Desikan took the challenge when appropriate, took a softer approach when appropriate, and took a safer and defensive approach when appropriate. Here “when appropriate” means, as the situation demanded for service to Perumal. Likewise in the life of Swamy Ramanujacharya too.
With this perspective, I don’t see any wishy-washy opinions here. And I don’t have to research on any of these instances on my own; because my intelligence is limited and I will never be able to fathom the depths of past times of our poorvacharyas. Our acharyas have clearly explained these, and I simply have to accept their explanations. ashTe’. VerEnu bedaa.
Srimate Raamanujaya Namaha,
Interesting discussion.
Just adding two more perspectives.
1.when following tradition there are many internal and subtler aspects..like shravanam, smaranam, etc..which can be followed anywhere anytime like Prahalada demonstrated.
2. Yes ideally one should move away from a place where freedom to practice is restricted…but also please note that there are different problems in india..which indirectly hinder practice..
So there is no perfect place other than vaikuntam to practice..
So we will have to adjust with what is available, but smaranam and sharavanam are possible anywhere and that is strong substitute for any tradition we may miss.
Adiyen
Badri swamy,
Emperumaanar went to Thirunarayanapuram not fearing the king.
The life incident of Emperumaanar says that he left the place as adviced by his disciples fearing the king, covering himself with white cloth, despite a sanyasi. adiyen also used to wonder why the stature of Emperumaanar has to evade and why Narayanan did not provide him power or strength to face, since Emperumaanar was sent by Narayanan Himself.
adiyen
What devareer said is superficial reasons. Emperumanaar pastimes during his melkote episode are the true reason.
Emperumaanar’s administration and management skills were admired esp., guidance for kainkaryam at SriRangam temple. He also would have been aware about the talks that can come up in future due to his leaving the city on the advice of his disciples. If he had to retrieve chella pillai or if there are some other reason for his departure, he could have faced the king and left.
Since he left the place under disguise stirs the point “fear”.
