Q: Can a spiritualist be a leader?

short Answer: Yes, if ordained by divine arrangement.

long answer: 

When Akkiyaazhvan, the court pandit demanded tribute from AaLavandar’s guru, AaLavandar decided to put him in his place. Eventually a debate was organised between AaLavandar and Akkiyaazhvan at the court.

One of the three propositions AaLavandar placed challenging Akkiyazhvan to disprove is, “the king is completely sinless”. Akkiyazhvan did not dare to disprove this; when he placed the challenge back to AaLavandar, he replied, “a king or leader incurs 1/6 of sins of the subjects. Therefore the king carries so much sins on himself.”

Based on this logic, we can conclude that only an insane person would desire and aspire to become a leader. However, if the kainkaryam of leading others towards the ultimate goal of llife is ordained upon a bhaktha, he humbly accepts that kainkaryam and executes with due diligence and caution.

Lakshmana muni (இளையாழ்வார்) did not desire to become a leader; he was quite happy rendering theertha kainkaryam to Varadarajar and kalashepam with Thirukkachchi nambi. However, when AaLavandar ordained him to serve in that position, he did not hesitate to become Yathiraja. Nor were any of the prominent disciples of AaLavandar aspiring to become a leader; they were simply eager to execute the respective kainkaryam ordained to them.

it is not that our Velukkudi Krishnan Swamy ‘aspired’ to become a leader. He simply applied himself to his father’s/guru’s instruction and guidance of other (contemprory) exalted Vaishnavas and acharyas. It so happens that by Thayar-Perumals’ desire so many people are following him; he is simply making himself flexible to accomodate the desires of the Divya-Dampathi.

In being a father/ mother, even we are ‘leaders’ at the family level; and we have to execute this responsibility of providing our dependents with the opportunity for spiritual progress. This we should do with full awareness that Perumal is the real leader and we are merely His nominated agent, and that we are simply doing this ‘leadership kainkaryam’ for His pleasure.

adiyen dasan.  

Srimathe Rangaramanuja Mahadesikaya Namaha
Srimathe Sri Varaha Mahadesikaya Namaha
Sri Velukkudi Krishnan Swamy Thiruvadigaley Sharanam
Sri:

First class
“Lakshmana muni (இளையாழ்வார்) did not desire to become a leader; he was quite happy rendering theertha kainkaryam to Varadarajar and kalashepam with Thirukkachchi nambi. ”

This morning was discussing with my mother regarding Udayavar theertha kainkaryam to Varadharajar and how SriRanganathan absorbed our Ramanujar. How Varadharajar felt the loss. It is stunning to see differences in Perumals.

Coming to Spirituality, it is understood that Guru shares the sins of his disciples.

This includes King and I suppose anyone in the leadership ladder like minister who holds a responsible position for the masses.

So if someone asks me to become a Guru can I become one?
I simply redirect them to our Velukkudi forum and apps.

Enakku pakkuvam kidaiyAdhu
Varavum varadhi

I should “Walk the talk” but I don’t

My Velukkudi Krishnan Swamy “Walks the talk”

Coming to Sri Velukkudi Krishnan Swamy, I owe my entire life to him. I usually don’t raise personal questions.

This is the problem with even learned people. They just assume things, attach some vested interest (உள் அர்த்தம் கர்ப்பிப்பது)

Question was crystal clear. How different was Sri Ramakrishna Paramhansa & Vivekananda style of spirituality?

முடிஞ்சா answer பண்ணுங்கோ

இல்லாட்டி திரும்பவும் விலகிகுறேன்

நீங்களே enjoy பண்ணுங்கோ உங்க “Spirituality”

I don’t want anymore BhAgavatha apachaarams
I had enough
Nimmadhi kidaikkum nu vandhen
இங்கேயும் as usual nimmadhi illa

Daasaanudaasan

Also I will tell why I raised this question
Namakku solli kuduthadhu “Daasa Bhaavam”.

Appo innoruthara daasana naama eppadi ethukka mudiyum?

Guru sthAnam yedhai kurikkiradhu?

Vikaram swamy, namaskaram.

It is stunning to see differences in Perumals.

Yes, it is amazing to see the varieties of moods in our Perumal. Varadhar is same as Ranganathar is same as Thirumalaiappan is same as Chellappillai. In each place He manifests moods in reciprocation to the devotees serving Him there. In Kanchi devotees were missing Ramanujar after he left for Srirangam; Varadhar reciprocated with that feeling. In Srirangam devotees were joyful to receive Ramanujacharya, and Ranganathar reciprocated that feeling. Therefore it is apropraite to say ‘variety is moods of Perumal’ rather than ‘differences in Perumals’. 

So if someone asks me to become a Guru can I become one?

If your guru orders you to be become guru of someone, yes you can and you should.

Enakku pakkuvam kidaiyAdhu; Varavum varadhi. I should “Walk the talk” but I don’t

In that case, your guru will not order you to be guru of someone.

Namakku solli kuduthadhu “Daasa Bhaavam”. Appo innoruthara daasana naama eppadi ethukka mudiyum?

நமக்கு மெய் தந்து, மலம் துடைத்து, அரவணைத்து நலமான வளமான வாழ்வமைத்து தரும் தாயின் உள்ளம் ‘தாஸ்ய பாவத்தின்’ சிறந்த எடுத்துக்காட்டன்றோ?

நமக்கு மெய் ஞானம் தந்து, (அக)மலம் துடைத்து, அறம் அளித்து, ஷாஸ்வத நலமும் வளமும் தரும் குரு கோடிக்கணக்கான தாய்க்கு ஈடன்றோ? அவர்தம் தாஸ்ய பாவத்தை என்ன வென்று சொல்வது? அப்படி தாஸ்ய பாவம் இல்லை என்றால் எப்படி அடியோங்களின் முட்டாள்தனங்களையும் முரண்டுகளை பொறுத்தருள முடியும்? ஒரு குரு, தன் குருவுக்கும் தாசன்; தன் அடியார்களுக்கும் தாசன். அப்படிபட்ட மனோபாவம் கொண்டவர் மட்டுமே குருவான நியமிக்கப்படுவார்.

உதாரணம் 1: தன்னிடம் உபதேசம் பெற்றவர்களுக்காக தான் நரகத்திற்கு கூட செல்ல துணிந்த தாசனே நம் எம்பெருமானார்.

உதாரணம் 2: அடியேனின் ஆச்சார்யன் அடியோங்களுடன் பேசும் போது, அவர் வார்த்தையில் அவ்வளவு தாஸ்ய பாவம் தோய்ந்திருக்கும்; நமக்கு கூச்சம் ஏற்படுத்தும்! 

This is the problem with even learned people. They just assume things, attach some vested interest (உள் அர்த்தம் கர்ப்பிப்பது) Question was crystal clear. How different was Sri Ramakrishna Paramhansa & Vivekananda style of spirituality?

தங்கள் பதிவில் “can spiritualist be a leader? Which quality should a spiritualist pursue?” என்பதே கேள்வி என்றும், ” Vivekananda is a spiritualist but considered more of a leader. Whereas his Guru Sri Ramakrishna Paramhansa was living solitary life.” என்பது கேள்வியை விளக்குவதற்காக வைக்கப்பட்ட எடுத்துக்காட்டு என்றும் அர்த்தம் கற்பித்துக்கொண்டு விட்டேன். தங்கள் கேள்வியே விவேகாநந்தர் மற்றும் ராமகிருஷ்ணரை பற்றியது என்று அடியேனின் சிற்றறிவுக்கு எட்டவில்லை; மன்னிக்கவும்; அடியேனுக்கு அந்த சம்பிரதாயத்தை சேர்ந்தவர்களை பற்றி விவரங்கள் தெரியாது.

முடிஞ்சா answer பண்ணுங்கோ. இல்லாட்டி திரும்பவும் விலகிகுறேன்

என்ன ஸ்வாமி இது!! அடியேன் சிற்றறிவாளனாக இருப்பதால், தங்கள் கேள்வியை சரியாக புரிந்து கொள்ளாமல்,  தங்களுக்கு தேவைபடும் விவரம் தர இயலாததால், தாங்கள் இந்த குழுவிலிருந்து விலகுவது எந்த விதத்தில் நியாயமகும். அடியேனின் அறியாமைக்கும் தாங்கள் விலகுவதற்க்கும் என்ன தொடர்பு உள்ளது?

நீங்களே enjoy பண்ணுங்கோ உங்க “Spirituality”

ஆசிக்கு நன்றி.

Nimmadhi kidaikkum nu vandhen; இங்கேயும் as usual nimmadhi illa

சில இடங்களில் நிம்மதி இல்லை என்றால், அவ்விடங்களுக்கு பொதுவான காரணி (common factor) என்னவென்று ஆராயவும். அந்த காரணியை தவிர்கவும். எவ்விடத்திலும் நிம்மதி இல்லை என்றால், எல்லா சூழ்நிலைகளிலும் பொதுவான காரணி என்னவென்று ஆராயவும். அந்த காரணியை தவிர்கவும். ஒருவேளை persecution complex காரணமாக இருக்கக் கூடுமொ?

அடியேன் தாசன்.

அட, இவ்வளவு ஏன் ஸ்வாமி! ஆச்சார்யர்களுகெல்லாம் ஆச்சார்யனான கீதாசார்யனே தேரோட்டியாக தாஸ்யம் புரிந்தவர்தாமே!

Namsakaram.

In recent times there has been a change in the style of expression in the queries / postings. The query is straight forward and clear.

Normally, in religion / spirituality, one who imparts / shares knowledge on religion / spirituality is called a preacher and guide, because they predominantly carry out preaching of religion / spiritual matters. Generally, if someone heads an organisation, which is an additional responsibility, they are mentioned as spiritual leader. But in the case of Srivaishnavites, adiyen believe, the head of an organisation is not called leader, e.g., a jeer who heads a mutt, is not called a leader, though a jeer (or Acharya) has additional responsibility towards their disciples’ moksha “propthy”.

Leading a solitary life is difficult in the present days. But one can lead a regular life developing qualities which he is expected to get in solitary life. It is better if anyone who is aspiring for moksham to develop such qualities.

The concept of dasyam need not be followed by people of various faith. It will be between the guru and disciple only and not with others. Yes. It is of course very much followed by Srivaishnavites. Vivekananda may be a dasan to his guru but need not be dasan to others as per their faith, which is not the case with Srivaishnavites. Hence, a direct comparison of dasyam quality may not be applicable with Vivekananda, as applicable with Srivaishnavites.

It is natural for one to expect a satisfactory response. But one should not become desperate and loose heart, thus paving way for Bhagavatha apacharam.

adiyen

Srimathe Rangaramanuja Mahadesikaya Namaha

@pd_jayaram Swamy,

“In recent times there has been a change in the style of expression in the queries / postings. ”
Swamy is it it in general or adiyen’s expression. Please explain if possible on devareer’s logical conclusion. Is it a positive or negative change?

“Srivaishnavites, adiyen believe, the head of an organisation is not called leader, e.g., a jeer who heads a mutt, is not called a leader, though a jeer (or Acharya) has additional responsibility towards their disciples’ moksha “propthy”

Fantastic.

“Hence, a direct comparison of dasyam quality may not be applicable with Vivekananda, as applicable with Srivaishnavites.”

Ok Swamy

“It is natural for one to expect a satisfactory response. But one should not become desperate and loose heart, thus paving way for Bhagavatha apacharam.”

Sari Swamy Adiyen will refrain from asking hereafter. Adiyen don’t wish to do postmortem & just move forward while just that Adiyen thought there was a possibility of distancing myself from “Sri Velukkudi Krishnan Swamy”.My mistake.

@Kambandasan Swamy 🙏🙏🙏🙏🙇🙇🙇🙇
“You have been one of those in the last category, and not seeing you gave some worries. Please take due care and keep well. Thank you very much”

Adiyen don’t see any such difference with anyone. The hungry one eats. It’s good that sath Sangam is striving because of great bhAgavathas like Devareer’ , jayaram Swamy,ElayAzhwar swamyand others

Also our Swamy is posting audios daily , Adiyen also remember our Swamy saying “less talking & more listening” .

So either way BhAgavathAs are following some principle. Just that we are unfortunate to get their answers or views.

Parikshit had Sukhar, all gathered to listen Srimath BhAgavatham.

Many times I used to think “this Swamy has great knowledge, he does good discourse. This Swamy does not give that much good discourse when compared to other swamies”.

Adiyen was proved wrong “In TTD SVBC2 channel, one Swamy was discoursing on Srivaishnavam in practice , Swamy started lessons for kids like , then he went to PhD mode and Adiyen could not understand that level of Vedic knowledge”

Similarly on Vittala Bhajans. Adiyen thought they will do only Bhajans but that Swamy started talking on Bheeshma Sthuthi & stuff. Flabbergasted.

Perumal taught Adiyen a good lesson “Never compare”

Some BhattAchAris may not share knowledge but they are with moolavar. Perumal chose them. Idha Vida enna venum?

UpanyAsam & upanayanam means to get us closer to him, bhattars are already closer with Perumal & thAyAr.

We cannot say who has what knowledge with respect to Srivaishnavam.

Some are generous to share with everyone like our asmad Swamy🙏🙏🙏🙏
Some preciously safeguard with themselves like Thirukkotiyur Nambigal Swamy 🙏🙏🙏🙏

Also in this digital age with scattered information all around we need a guiding light.

Swamigals we need no bhayam
Yesterday listened to Srimad Bhagavatham of our Sri Velukkudi Krishnan Swamy
Swamy shared Narayana Kavacham

Then only realised we are safe in his lotus hands why fear?

In Matsya avatharam Perumal saved true devotees. He will save us now also. It is his responsibility. If PerumAL forgets I will remind him like SeethA pirAtti.

This is the time for Srimad BhAgavatha sapthAham, Ma munigal KAlakshepam & so on…

Enjoyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy

Dasanudasan

Many thanks to all periyava for your sharing 🙏

Srimathe Rangaramanuja Mahadesikaya Namaha
Yesterday Velukkudi Swamy’s Srimad Bhagavatham 2019 , Narasimha avathAram at my home.

Vandhutaar thalaivar

EzhiyAchu Ezhundhu AruliyAchu jammunu

Pidari kesham parakka
Narasimhar witnessed swayam in the Hiranyakashipu’s pool of blood.

Adiyen obsessed with this shloka

ŚB 7.8.17
सत्यं विधातुं निजभृत्यभाषितं
व्याप्तिं च भूतेष्वखिलेषु चात्मन: ।
अद‍ृश्यतात्यद्भ‍ुतरूपमुद्वहन्
स्तम्भे सभायां न मृगं न मानुषम् ॥ १७ ॥
satyaṁ vidhātuṁ nija-bhṛtya-bhāṣitaṁ
vyāptiṁ ca bhūteṣv akhileṣu cātmanaḥ
adṛśyatātyadbhuta-rūpam udvahan
stambhe sabhāyāṁ na mṛgaṁ na mānuṣam

Pul arikaradhu
Mayir kuchoriyaeadhu
PulakAnkitham
Poorippu
Roma Harshanam

Bayangaram, vandhutaar Narasimhar
Ugram Veeram MahAvishnum
Jwalantham SarvathO Mukham
Nrusimham Bheeshanam Badram
Mrutyur Mrutyum Namahyaham

Ha ha ha ha ha ha

Ithi attahAsa

Dasanudasan

Srimathe Rangaramanuja Mahadesikaya Namaha
Srimathe Sri Varaha Mahadesikaya Namaha
Sri Velukkudi Krishnan Swamy Thiruvadigaley Sharanam
Sri:
Narasimharey Narasimhara pathi kekkalAmA?
SriRaman Lava Kusha kitta kekkarA mAdhiri irukkey

Velukkudi SAdhikirar,
Ariya Paduvadhu Achith
Aribhavan AathmA

Then AthmA can only be explained by theory of negation

Idhu dhAn nu pin point panna mudiyAdhu

Inga pArumgO
Na Mrigam na mAnusham

Mrigamum alla Manidhanum alla

SariyApOchA paramAthmA description

This mami / guru explaining in Sanskrit

Dasanudasan