Controversial question on Veda will he be classified as Veda Bahyar or Veda Kudrishti?

enpanifan 3 0 on March 25, 2020

Srimate Ramanujaya namaha.

Namaskaaram.

My thought is Vedas/spiritual sages encourage questions as we see Bhagavat Gita , Bhagavatam etc are all full of questions. Asking question is not wrong, only the attitude of the question makes a question right or wrong.

It is not necessary to accept an answer before questioning, but need to accept and trust the authority to whom we are placing the question. If not there is no need to ask the question.

After answer is given , we can ask for more explanation or can say that we are unable to understand, but should not think that the authority who gave the answer is wrong.

Arguments based on popular interpretation of vedas as given by many acharyas is Vaadam and Arguments based on one’s own thoughts and interpretation is vidanda Vaadam.

The basic foundation or axioms have to be accepted and not debated as we are not eligible to understand them yet. Based on these axioms further questions can be asked that is Vaadam. Questioning the axioms itself is called vidanda Vaadam.

Adiyen

vikraminside 0 on March 26, 2020

Srimathe Rangaramanuja Mahadesikaya Namaha
Srimathe Sri Varaha Mahadesikaya Namaha
Sri Velukkudi Krishnan Swamy Thiruvadigaley Sharanam

Swamy,

That sounds great. We cannot expect the questioner to be in the same platform as ours. “Kavi Tharkikka Simham ” nu Swamy Desikan pattam vangi irukkar.

Udayavar jain bouddha ellar kittayum 1000 heads vechundu argument panni jeyichirukkar.

Ava ava, ava route lerndhu dhan kelvi keppa
Namakku venumna authoritya irukkalam but mathavalukku nu oru Standard Operating Procedure (SOP) irukka?

Dasanudasan

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vikraminside 0 on March 26, 2020

Devareer kuda “My thought is Vedas/spiritual sages encourage questions as we see Bhagavat Gita , Bhagavatam etc are all full of questions.”

It means devareer interpret based on some existing references right?

enpanifan 0 on March 27, 2020

Srimate Ramanujaye Namaha,

Namaskaaram.

I suppose you are referring to scenario where people don’t accept authority of acharyas and then they debate. Yes agreed it is not easy.

Essentially, both cannot reach to any conclusion in such debates as arguments are based on limited experience of our perceived knowledge and topic of discussion is very very subtle. So essentially nothing can be proved conclusively.

Even if we have a SOP (Standard operating procedure) why would the other person accept the SOP, there will be debate on the SOP also. It is better to ask them what SOP they would prefer and they would most probably end up saying we need scientific proof , to show existence of God using material instruments and senses.

But based on the references you have stated about Sri Ramnujar debating with Jains , i think they might have had a basic SOP for logical debates and most essential pre-requisite might have been honesty, which most people in the current era don’t maintain during debates.

So SOP for current era would be to establish that even fundamental axioms of modern science are based on faith and cannot be proven. Similarly we have a certain fundamental axioms. They believe a system which they cannot prove ( they can prove small effects but not in the realm of large domains in space and time like how world originated etc) and we believe in system with our own axioms. So the debate has to be on the system of belief, who created, what are their motives and which is a more reliable system and why.. if this is resolved and cleared then the conclusions of that system will clarify the question/issue under discussion. Other wise debating on any particular issue will not lead to a conclusion.

Also reg, if stating that Bhagavatham and Bhagavat Gita are full of questions was a interpretation, i would clarify that these are facts found in references we accept. But the phrase ” My thought is ” referring to the fact that this reference “may be” relevant to this current discussion. So the facts itself are not interpreted.

Adiyen

Srimate Ramanujaye Namaha, 
Namaskaaram.  
I suppose you are referring to scenario where people  don't accept authority of acharyas and then they debate. Yes agreed it is not easy. 
Essentially, both cannot reach to any conclusion in such debates as arguments are based on limited experience of our perceived knowledge and topic of discussion is very very subtle. So essentially nothing can be proved conclusively. 
Even if we have a SOP (Standard operating procedure) why would the other person accept the SOP, there will be debate on the SOP also.  It is better to ask them what SOP they would prefer and they would most probably end up saying we need scientific proof , to show existence of God using material instruments and senses. 
But based on the references you have stated about Sri Ramnujar debating with Jains ,  i think they might have had a basic SOP for logical debates and most essential pre-requisite might have been honesty, which most people in the current era don't maintain during debates. 
So SOP for current era would be to establish that even fundamental axioms of modern science are based on faith and cannot be proven. Similarly we have a certain fundamental axioms. They believe a system which they cannot prove ( they can prove small effects but not in the realm of large domains in space and time like how world originated etc) and we believe in system with our own axioms. So the debate has to be on the system of belief, who created, what are their motives and which is a more reliable system and why.. if this is resolved and cleared then the conclusions of that system will clarify the question/issue under discussion. Other wise debating on any particular issue will not lead to a conclusion. 
Also reg, if stating that Bhagavatham and Bhagavat Gita are full of questions was a interpretation, i would clarify that these are facts found in references we accept. But the phrase " My thought is " referring to the fact that this reference "may be" relevant to this current discussion. So the facts itself are not interpreted. 
Adiyen

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Srimate Ramanujaya namaha. 
Namaskaaram. 
My thought is Vedas/spiritual sages encourage questions as we see Bhagavat Gita , Bhagavatam etc are all full of questions. Asking question is not wrong, only the attitude of the question makes a question right or wrong. 
It is not necessary to accept an answer before questioning, but need to accept and trust the authority to whom we are placing the question. If not there is no need to ask the question.  
After answer is given , we can ask for more explanation or can say that we are unable to understand, but should not think that the authority who gave the answer is wrong.  
Arguments based on popular interpretation of vedas as given by many acharyas is Vaadam and Arguments based on one's own thoughts and interpretation is vidanda Vaadam. 
The basic foundation or axioms have to be accepted and not debated as we are not eligible to understand them yet. Based on these axioms further questions can be asked that is Vaadam. Questioning the axioms itself is called vidanda Vaadam. 
  
Adiyen

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ElayaAlwar 0 0 on March 28, 2020

Srimathe Ramanujaya Namaha,

Namaskaram Vikram Swami and Anand Swami (enpanifan),

Beautiful question and conversations.

Velukkudi Sri Krishnan Swami has Graced answer in today’s Enpani #1693,

Adiyen (ElayaAlwar) Srinivasa (DhoddayAcharyar) Dasan

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vikraminside 0 0 on March 28, 2020

Srimathe Rangaramanuja Mahadesikaya Namaha
Srimathe Sri Varaha Mahadesikaya Namaha
Sri Velukkudi Krishnan Swamy Thiruvadigaley Sharanam

Swamy
Dhanyosmi 😊
🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🙏🙏🙏
Answered in EnPaNi 1693

Adiyen listened
Adiyen getting new breathe of life

Dasanudasan

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vikraminside 0 0 on March 28, 2020

@Enpanifan swamy Dhanyosmi
@Elayalwar swamy Dhanyosmi
🙇🏻‍♂️🙇🏻‍♂️🙇🏻‍♂️🙇🏻‍♂️🙇🏻‍♂️🙇🏻‍♂️🙇🏻‍♂️🙇🏻‍♂️

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Badrinarayana Ramanuja Dasan 1 0 on March 29, 2020

Beautiful conversations as mentioned by ElayaAlwar Swami. However, adiyen had a thought after hearing EnPani 1693 and was amazed by the priceless mercy of our Sri Velukkudi Swami on prapanna kulam and all of us.

For a walking legend, who has mastered the Divya Prabhandam, Vedas, Upanishads, Bhagavad Gita, Vishnu Sahasra Namam, Ithikasas, Puranas, Sastras like Nyaya, Mimamsa, and Vyakaranam, works of our great Purchacharyas Alavandaar, emPerumanaar, Bhattar, Kurath Alwaar, Koora Narayana Jeeyar, Nanjiyar, Nampillai, Perivachaan Pillai, Vedanta Desikar, Manavala Mamunigal, pinbhazhagiya perumAL jIyar, Srinivasa (Yatindra Mata Deepika), Annangaracharyar (Suprabatham), learned and descended from the great lineage of Sri Velukkudi Varathachariar Swamigal, visited 106 divyadesams many times (also gave others the opportunity to enjoy them along with him) and delivered multiple lectures on their mahatmiyam, delivered over 20,000 hours of spiritual lectures on above topics across the globe (just adiyen’s collection), runs veda patasalas, does various kaimkariyams in diya desams, till date answered 1694 queries through enpani and 100’s of queries through this forum, master in materials sciences as well (CA), adiyen even ran out of energy to recall and write about the service of our Swami to emPerumaan, says the best way to attain Moksha is to simply follow our acharyas and serve them. When we are all blessed to be part of a sampradaya that is so easy and simple, there is no reason for us to question and be worried.

Dear Sri Velukkudi Krishnan Swami we are all blessed to be contemporaries when you are beautifully decorating this earth. What to say about your mercy…

Adiyen,
Badrianarayana Ramanuja Dasan.

vikraminside 0 on April 2, 2020

Srimathe Rangaramanuja Mahadesikaya Namaha
Srimathe Sri Varaha Mahadesikaya Namaha
Sri Velukkudi Krishnan Swamy Thiruvadigaley Sharanam

Sri:
Yes devareer is correct. Our Swamy is avatharam. This is real gyanam. Spiritual growth is only growth.

Adiyen also ask controversy questions to make my swamy answer so that Adiyen stay in Swamy’s heart

Adiyen look good or bad no issue but Velukkudi Krishnan Swamy ennai ninaikanum

Avar chinthanaiyil adiyen oru thuli irundhal janma phalan kidaithidum

Dasanudasan

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Beautiful conversations as mentioned by ElayaAlwar Swami. However, adiyen had a thought after hearing EnPani 1693 and was amazed by the priceless mercy of our Sri Velukkudi Swami on prapanna kulam and all of us. 
For a walking legend, who has mastered the Divya Prabhandam, Vedas, Upanishads, Bhagavad Gita, Vishnu Sahasra Namam, Ithikasas, Puranas, Sastras like Nyaya, Mimamsa, and Vyakaranam, works of our great Purchacharyas Alavandaar, emPerumanaar, Bhattar, Kurath Alwaar, Koora Narayana Jeeyar, Nanjiyar, Nampillai, Perivachaan Pillai, Vedanta Desikar, Manavala Mamunigal, pinbhazhagiya perumAL jIyar, Srinivasa (Yatindra Mata Deepika), Annangaracharyar (Suprabatham), learned and descended from the great lineage of Sri Velukkudi Varathachariar Swamigal, visited 106 divyadesams many times (also gave others the opportunity to enjoy them along with him) and delivered multiple lectures on their mahatmiyam, delivered over 20,000 hours of spiritual lectures on above topics across the globe (just adiyen's collection), runs veda patasalas, does various kaimkariyams in diya desams, till date answered 1694 queries through enpani and 100's of queries through this forum, master in materials sciences as well (CA), adiyen even ran out of energy to recall and write about the service of our Swami to emPerumaan, says the best way to attain Moksha is to simply follow our acharyas and serve them.  When we are all blessed to be part of a sampradaya that is so easy and simple, there is no reason for us to question and be worried.  
Dear Sri Velukkudi Krishnan Swami we are all blessed to be contemporaries when you are beautifully decorating this earth. What to say about your mercy... 
Adiyen, Badrianarayana Ramanuja Dasan.

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Controversial question on Veda will he be classified as Veda Bahyar or Veda Kudrishti?

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