Clarification in ramayana Aranya Kanda sarga 11 verse 57

Updated on April 3, 2020 in Holy Books
32 on January 3, 2020

Srimate Ramanujaye namaha!

Namaskaaram!

I was reading a small portion of summary of Ramayanam every day, Yesterday it was Aranya Kanda Sarga 11, in which it was portion where Lord Rama was narrating ( to mother Sita and Lakshmana) the  story of Vatapi and how he was killed by Agastya.

In the story narration,it was stated that the two demoniac brothers continued to bring Brahmins for feast and offered them ram which the brahmins ate and then Vatapi used to come out as a full goat killing them. In the same way when they tried with sage Agastya , but sage Agastaya digested and killed Vatapi.

So the question here is how is it that the brahmins who were killed earlier accepted ram/goat as food?

I thought the summary i was reading was wrong so went to look for the actual verse which also surprisingly has the word “mesha” (aranya kanda – saraga 11- verse 57)

भ्रातरम् संस्कृतम् कृत्वा ततः तम् मेष रूपिणम् |
तान् द्विजान् भोजयामास श्राद्ध दृष्टेन कर्मणा || ४-११-५७

Kindly clarify how to understand this?  Is it because in that yuga brahmins were not required to be vegetarians as it is now? if so is there any known reason?

In Sage Agastya ‘s case it is clear that because he wanted to kill him it is understandable , but it is unclear about the previous brahmins.

Kindly clarify.

Adiyen.

 

 

 
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This question has been answered earlier.

on January 4, 2020

Srimate Ramanujaye namaha,
Dhanyosmi swami..?
Heard the old enpani audios as pointed out below.
Satisfied with the answer that the prescription of rules are given for each yuga depending on the quality nature and strength of the people of that yuga.
Adiyen.

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2 on January 4, 2020

Srimathe Ramanujaya Namaha,

 

Namaskaram Enpanifan BhagavAta,

 

As Sri Velukkudi Swamy mentioned in the above thread, here is Swamy’s past enpani #143 “Non Vegetarian in Earlier Yugas” and additional supplement enpani #231 “why stop non veg”,

https://www.kinchit.org/kinchit-en-pani/101-150/

https://www.kinchit.org/kinchit-en-pani/201-250/

 

Sri Velukkudi Swamy has said Shastras ALWAYS say “Ahimsa Paramo Dharmaha” all the time for all Yugas. Some people (either Brahmin or kShatriya or Vaishya or non-brahmin varnas) eating in any yuga as seen in ithihaasas or puranaas is NOT an advocation by Shastras, since it is a akruthya karaNam sin (rejected by Shastras) and the sub-category is

  • para himsai – giving trouble to any living being. even hurting a plant or small ant unnecessarily is not accepted in ShAstram.

– and People (any varnas) who do such sins by eating it JUST for ONE TIME in any yugas have to do strenous Prayaschittam as per Shastras.

– and People (any varnas) who want to develop “Satva Guna” for BhagavAn Sri KRISHNA’S Preethyartham for Kainkaryam and Moksham (NO RE-BIRTH) mandatorily abstain from it.

–  and People (any varnas) who want to develop “Rajas/Tamas Gunas” eat whatever goes inside their mouth for “Continuous Birth-Death cycle”.

 

Mahabharata “Mahaprasthanika Parva” has many verses as below and so do Taittriya Shakha of Yajur Veda and many texts……..

 

अहिंसा परमॊ धर्मस तथाहिंसा परॊ दमः।
अहिंसा परमं दानम अहिंसा परमस तपः।
अहिंसा परमॊ यज्ञस तथाहिस्मा परं बलम।
अहिंसा परमं मित्रम अहिंसा परमं सुखम।
अहिंसा परमं सत्यम अहिंसा परमं शरुतम॥

Ahimsa is the highest virtue, Ahimsa is the highest self-control, 
Ahimsa is the greatest gift, Ahimsa is the best suffering, 
Ahimsa is the highest sacrifice, Ahimsa is the finest strength, 
Ahimsa is the greatest friend, Ahimsa is the greatest happiness, 
Ahimsa is the highest truth, and Ahimsa is the greatest teaching.

 

Conclusion,

So, some people (either Brahmin or kShatriya or Vaishya or non-brahmin varnas) eating in any yuga as seen in ithihaasas or puranaas or now is NOT an advocation by Shastras, since it is a akruthya karaNam para himsai” sin (rejected by Shastras, since it is Against the Supreme BhagavAn Sri Rama’s Thiru Ullam)

 

????

Adiyen Srinivasa (DhoddayAcharyar) Dasan,

Sri Velukkudi Krishnan Swami ThiruvAdigalaey Sharanam,

Acharyar ThiruvAdigalaey Sharanam.

on January 4, 2020

Srimate Ramanujaye namaha,
Namaskaaram swami,
Thanks for pointing to the specific audio.
Please note that the first audio is probably #148 as that is what i saw in the actual list. Just listing it here for future readers of this thread.

Adiyen

on February 5, 2020

Please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Sripada Ramanujacharya. All glories to Srila Prabhupada.

In this connection, I would like to clarify a doubt regarding Lord Rama consuming meat as stated in final sloka of the 52nd chapter of Ayodhya Kandha.

tau tatra hatvā caturaḥ mahā mṛgān |
varāham ṛśyam pṛṣatam mahā rurum |
ādāya medhyam tvaritam bubhukṣitau|
vāsāya kāle yayatur vanaḥ patim || 2-52-102

Having hunted there four deer, namely Varaaha, Rishya, Prisata; and Mahaaruru (the four principal species of deer) and taking quickly the portions that were pure, being hungry as they were, Rama and Lakshmana reached a tree to take rest in the evening.

Also below is a sloka spoken by Sita Devi

surāghaṭasahasreṇa māṃsabhūtodanena ca |
yakṣye tvām prayatā devi purīm punarupāgatā || 2-52-89

“Oh, goddess! After reaching back the city of Ayodhya, I shall worship you with thousand pots of spirituous liquor and jellied meat with cooked rice well prepared for the solemn rite.”

I have asked some devotees regarding this when I was at Sri Rangam. However their answers were not conclusive. I pray that Vaisnavas in this forum may be merciful as to dispel my doubt.

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3 on February 6, 2020

Srimathe Ramanujaya Namaha,

 

Namaskaram “Rpd” Swami,

 

With Acharya ThiruvAdi Bhalam and Velukkudi Swami’s Aasirvadham, Adiyen will share the true details of the Valmiki Ramayanam 2-52-89 slokam meaning.

 

In Ayodhya kandam 2, Sargham 57 last Slokams are basically sadness. Sita Devi is actually in deep sorrow looking at Her Husband SriRama’s state in forest during exile.

 

So in slokams 87 &88, Sita Devi is actually praying to the Demi godess Gangs as:

 

सा त्वां देवि नमस्यामि प्रशंसामि च शोभने।
प्राप्तराज्ये नरव्याघ्रे शिवेन पुनरागते।।2.52.87।।
गवां शतसहस्राणि वस्त्राण्यन्नं च पेशलम्।
ब्राह्मणेभ्यः प्रदास्यामि तव प्रियचिकीर्षया।।2.52.88।।

 

saa tvaam devi namasyaami prashamsaami ca shobhane |
praapta raajye nara vyaaghra shivena punar aagate || 2-52-87
gavaam shata sahasraaNi vastraaNi annam ca peshalam |
braahmaNebhyaH pradaasyaami tava priya cikiirSayaa || 2-52-88

 

Meaning in short from online books:

O Devi O lovely Ganga I offer you my obeisance and my adorations. After the safe return of Rama, the tiger (best) among men, from the forest and after he regains the kingdom I shall give a hundred thousand cows, clothing and delicious food to brahmins as a mark of regard, which will please you.

 

*********

So how come the next slokam 89, will reflect Sita Devi praying to Ganga as She will offer liquor and meat to Ganga after returning to Ayodhya if their forest life is protected by demi-gods. We need to understand Ganga river is nothing but ThiruVikrama Perumals Shree Paadha Theertham as seen in Mahabali incident. So how will Ganga accept liquor and meat.

 

So we have to use common sense and squash the Veda Kudhristis who have been providing incorrect meanings in translation of the slokam 89 as devareer mentioned in above thread.

 

Here is the correct meaning of the slokam 89.

 

सुराघटसहस्रेण मांसभूतौदनेन च।
यक्ष्ये त्वां प्रयता देवि पुरीं पुनरुपागता।।2.52.89।।

SuraaGhataSahasreNa maamsabhuutodanena cha |
yakshye tvaam prayataa devi puriim punarupaagataa || 2-52-89

 

सुराघटसहस्रेण

सुरा (Sura) means water or nectar. It could honey nectar or coconut water.

SurapAna means liquor. This verse doesn’t tell SurapAna, it is only “Sura”.

घट (Ghata) means Pot,

सहस्रेण (Sahasrena) means thousands

 

मांसभूतौदनेन

मांस (Mamsa) means fleshy. Fleshy substance can be obtained from living brings like animals or from fruits.

Like, if you ask a foreigner how to cut open raw coconut? ? , he will say, first cut open the outer meat of coconut, then we can see the shell of coconut. This outer meat doesn’t mean “meat” of an animal, it means the “Thicker portion” of coconut. Now, if we ask what is inside coconut shell, he will say,

‘1. Coconut Water,

‘2. Coconut Flesh, 

 

So in the slokam 89 मांस (Mamsa) means fleshy, so fleshy of what? is next question, so the remaining continuation of the word to be looked into it, which is

भूतौदनेन (bhUtodana / भूतोदन ) means dish made of rice,

So मांसभूतौदनेन

means a “thicker dish made of rice“, it could be anything like fluffy ஆப்பம், etc…like the “coconut Flesh” means मांसनारिकेल, and it doesn’t mean coconut prepared with animal meat.

 

So here is the correct meaning if verse 2-52-89:

O Devi after my return to Ayodhya purified by my austerities, I shall worship you by offering a thousand pots of nectar and thicker (fleshy) dish made of rice.

 

So we need to careful about these Veda Kudhristis who study Veda/Sanskrit and propogate incorrect meanings to defame our MARYADHA PURUSHOTTHAMAN SRIRAMA and PIOUS SITA PIRATTI.

 

Nirai Irundhaal adiyenudaya Acharya ThiruvAdi Bhalatthaal and Velukkudi Swami Aasirvadhatthaal.

Kurai Irundhaal adiyenai kShamikka Prarthikkiraen

?????️??

Adiyen Srinivasa DhoddayAcharyar Dasan.

on February 6, 2020

Dear prabhu,

Thank you very much for your clarification on the 89th verse. Can similar clarification be given to the 102nd verse of the same sarga? It states that the Lord partook meat.

Your servant.

on February 14, 2020

Sri ElayaAlwar Swamy
Thanks for the beautiful post
Dasanudasan

on March 3, 2020

Adiyen Charamavathi Dasan Vikram Swami

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3 on February 7, 2020

Srimathe Ramanujaya Namaha,

Sure “Rama Prabhu Dasan ‘Rpd'” Swami, 

Adiyen will share the true meaning of 2-52-102 slokam meaning with Acharya ThiruvAdi Bhalam and Velukkudi Swami’s Aasirvadham later due to time constraints.

 

Meantime, Adiyen has three requests to devareer,

1) Devareer mentioned in above thread as “I have asked some devotees regarding this when I was at Sri Rangam. However their answers were not conclusive”.

So adiyen want to confirm if the slokam 89 meaning is Conclusive or not.

 

2) If Yes, can devareer propogate the actual meaning of slokam 89 to the SriVaishnavas at Sri Rangam?, only to those whomever devareer has asked this doubht, whenever devareer’s time permits.

 

3) Since devareer has GRATTITUDE (krithagyatha) towards devareer’s “Upakara Acharya” GuruParamparai (Srila Prabhupadha) as well as towards the “UDDHARAKA Acharyan” Swami Ramanujar as seen in devareer’s statement in above thread as “All glories to Sripada Ramanujacharya. All glories to Srila Prabhupada.”, So adiyen request devareer when visit Swami Ramanujar Sannidhi in SriRangam, can devareer buy a Archanai ticket and give it to priest to perform “Lokha Shema Athma Ujjivanam” for everyone under Swami Ramanujar’s Lotus Feet through devareer’s GuruParamparai. It’s just a request, if devareer’s time permits.

 

இந்த Dealing அடியேனுக்கு ரொம்ப புடிச்சு இருக்கு

 

????????

Adiyen Srinivasa (DhoddayAcharyar) Dasan

on February 8, 2020

Dear prabhu,

These are the answers to your questions.

1. Yes. Verse 89 is totally clear to me now. I’m grateful for your kind clarification.
2. I’m afraid I will not be able to do this as the devotees I asked are way senior and advanced than me. In comparison to their knowledge and stature I’m nobody. I will take it as not that they weren’t able to answer me but rather I’m too foolish to comprehend what they told me that I found it inconclusive.
3. I will take your request as an opportunity to serve a Vaisnava. It’s very rare to get an opportunity to serve a Vaisnava. This is a boon to me. The next time Lord Arangan allows me entry into His abode at Sri Rangam, I will fulfill this request.

I will be eagerly waiting for the explanation on the 102nd verse.

*In my humble opinion in line with guru, sadhu, and sastra, photos of the Lord as above is not approved by acharyas. The Lord should be dressed as He eternally is in His abode and according arca-vigraha seva viddhi as given in Agamas and as directed by acharyas. Sunglasses and hats are the creation of mlecchas. The Lord in His nitya-lila never ever wears those. Forgive me if I have caused an offense by stating this.

Your insignificant servant.

on February 14, 2020

This is super & really interesting
Not sure how i missed

on March 3, 2020

Adiyen Charamavathi Dasan Vikram Swami

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3 on February 10, 2020

Srimathe Ramanujaya Namaha,

Namaskaram Rama Prabhu Dasan ‘Rpd’ Swami,

Adiyen Charamavati Dasan to devareer’s Prompt and Honest responses when it was only a request from adiyen.

‘1) Dhanyosmi Swami. All credits to KKC Sholinghur DhoddayAcharyar-Vedanthacharyar-Kuramasingarcharyar-Velukkudi Swamigal Thiruvadigalil Samarpanam.

‘2) Dhanyosmi Swami. Devareer’s decision makes sense.

‘3) Dhanyosmi Swami for devareer’s Kainkaryam with devareer’s Achaya Krupai.

Regaridng the Supreme BhagavAn SriKrishna’s photo with Sun Glasses and a Hat was actually a picture of ACTUAL KRISHA IDOL (not morphing or a digital gimmicks), which was either taken or posted by Nityadaas Swami a Krishna devotee as in below link, from where adiyen pulled.

https://www.pinterest.com/Abhinnatma/beauty/

This type of Alankaram could have been made on a small Krishna temple or it could be someone’s personal liking to see Krishna in Hat and Glasses in their home idol, not sure. But, anything on KRISHNA is Beautiful to see, since the SunGlasses and Hats are also KRISHNA’s Creation according to a “Matured Devotees” view point, since Nothing can exisit in this world without HIS Sankalpam, but some new entry devotees like adiyen who is in transition from Materialism to Spiritualism may frame it as Mlecchas creation, but that is not the actual truth. The reason why PoorvAcharyas don’t prescribe these type of Alankaram in General is due to the fact for our own benefit, since our past life was FULL of Materialism without involvement of Supreme Lord Sri Krishna, so when we apply a different attire in Spiritualism, it helps to keep our MIND in spiritual path, by forgetting our past Vaasanas.

However, if adiyen or devareer unknowingly say in above thread as Sunglasses and hats are the creation of mlecchas. it can possibly affect the Krishna devotee Nithyadaas Swami, where Nityadaas has also posted other beautiful Lord Krishna’s photos along with this picture. Moreover, we also work in some hat factory or sunglass factory or jeans factory for earning to live, to buy things for Sri Krishna Thiru Aaradhanai, plus do charity or donate as kainkaryams, so adiyen believe, we also fall in Mleccha category according to the above definition. This is adiyen’s personal observation or opinion.

However devareer’s view point is True as seen in below link,

Krishna idol dressed in T-shirt, jeans sparks row in Vrindavan”

https://zeenews.india.com/home/krishna-idol-dressed-in-t-shirt-jeans-sparks-row-in-vrindavan_323128.html

Meantime, Adiyen is compiling 2-52-102 details with Acharya ThiruvAdi Bhalam and Velukkudi Sri KrishnanSwami’s Aasirvadham and BhagavAta’s Abhimaanam that SriRama and Lakshmana did not eat meat. The actual verse meaning is a Swapadesha Artham.

 

Adiyen Srinivasa (DhoddAcharya) Dasan.

on February 12, 2020

Dear prabhu,

Please forgive me if I’ve said anything that might have caused Vaisnava Aparadha. I submit to your feet and pray that you please don’t take it personally.

vancha-kalpatarubhyash cha
kripa-sindhubhya eva cha
patitanam pavanebhyo
vaishnavebhyo namo namaha

I offer my respectful obeisances unto all the Vaishnava devotees of the Lord. They are just like desire trees who can fulfill the desires of everyone, and they are full of compassion for the fallen conditioned souls.

Your servant.

on February 14, 2020

????

on March 3, 2020

Adiyen Charamavathi Dasan Rpd Swami

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7 on February 12, 2020

Srimathe Ramanujaya Namaha,

 

Namaskaram Rama Prabhu Dasan ‘Rpd’ Swami & All Swami’s,

 

With Acharya ThiruvAdi Bhalam and Velukkudi Swami’s Aasirvadham, adiyen will continue to share the true meaning of 2-52-102 Valmiki Ramayanam Ayodhya Kanda 2 Sargam 52 slokam 102 meaning.

तौ तत्र हत्वा चतुरो महामृगान्

वराहमृश्यं पृषतं महारुरुम्।

आदाय मेध्यं त्वरितं बुभुक्षितौ

वासाय काले ययतुर्वनस्पतिम्।।2.52.102।।

 

tau tatra hatvā caturaḥ mahā mṛgān |
varāham ṛśyam pṛṣatam mahā rurum |
ādāya medhyam tvaritam bubhukṣitau|
vāsāya kāle yayatur vanaḥ patim || 2-52-102

 

 

***********************

Devareer’s above thread initial posting for 2-52-102 translation shows as follows:

Having hunted there four deer, namely Varaaha, Rishya, Prisata; and Mahaaruru (the four principal species of deer) and taking quickly the portions that were pure, being hungry as they were, Rama and Lakshmana reached a tree to take rest in the evening.

********************

 

Actually the verse doesn’t talk about four types of deer’s. These are four different Animals.

मृग: means Animal or Deer

मृगान् is animals or deer’s

In this context मृगान् is Animals and not deer’s:

वराह : Wild Boar

ऋश्यम् : White footed antelope

पृषतं : White spots antelope

महारुरु : Black stripes antelope

Since the last three are antelopes, its appearance is actually like deer, so there is confusion that all four were deer’s.

So चतुरो means four & महामृगान् means big animals.

चतुरो महामृगान् means four big/gigantic Animals and not actually four deer’s, of which one was a wild boar and other three were different antelopes.

 

So, now the Confusion that will arise in the readers mind is, How does it matter, if it is four deer’s or four animals, still the message of the slokam SEEMS that all the four either deer or animals were killed for food. So, is it True or not?.

Hence the answer is NO, SriRama DIDNOT physically kill any animal to partake as food. Details as follows.

 

 

************************************

Valmiki Ramayanam has many “Swapadesha Arthams (Special In-Depth Meaning)” which is NOT visible when we read by ourselves or read the General available Translations, unless we get the sandwich meanings hidden between the lines from our “Oran Vazhi GuruParamparai PoorvAcharyas Vyakyanams“ blessed to us through Velukkudi Swami’s Upanyasams/Kalakshepams.

 

Before getting into the Swapdesha Artham of 2-52-102, we need to get a Grip of the Swapadesha Artham of the Whole Valmiki Ramayanam Essence as below, so that we are prepared and confident in understanding the Swapadesha Artham of verse 2-52-102.

Like,

  1. SriRama is Supreme BhagavAn ParamAthma, but he took Manushya Avatram to shows us how to lead a Pious life in Samsaram, and do Sharanagathy and reach Moksham.
  2. Sita Piratti is “ParaMAthikai” who is AntarAthma or Better Half of ParamAthma. SHE also took Manushya Avataram along with SriRama to show how a Women should lead their life as a ”PathiVratha Sthree”, and also to show us three things
    • a) Krupai/Irakkam/Mercy to all people “JeevaAthamas”.
    • b) Parathanthriyam (to be sub-servient to ONLY to PramAthma all the time).
    • c) AnanyargAtvam (No one else to be thought or served except BhagavAn Sriman NarayanA like a PathiVratha Sthree to Her Husband).
  1. Ravan’s regime represents No BhagavAt Bhakti (Abhaktha Sthal) with exception like Vibhishana Azhvan.
  2. Sita Piratti is represented as a BhaddAthma (Just for Avataram purpose ONLY, though SHE is ParamAthikai) in Ashoka Vanam (in Lanka) for 10 months representing a Child’s struggle inside a Mother’s Garbham,
  3. Manasu (Mind) is Ravanan,
  4. Ravan’s 10 Heads represents 5 Gyanadriyams & 5 Karmedriyams.
    • Saptha Sparisha Roopa Rasa Gandham (Sound Touch Vision Taste Smell) are 5 Gyanedriyams, through which one can understand things.
    • Kai, Kaal, Naakku, Jala and Mala dwarams (Hands, Legs, Tongue, Urine and Stool excretion holes) are 5 Karmedriyams, through which we do our actions.
  5. So, Ravan causing trouble to Sita Piratti for 10 months, represents our Mind (Ravan) with all these 10 Pulangal (5 Gyanedriyams & 5 Karmedriyams , 10 heads)) causing trouble to us in this Samsaram hindering BhagavAt Bhakthi.
  6. Ocean between Ravan’s lace and SriRama’s place represents the “Samsaram of misery”.
  7. SriRama Dhoodthan Sri Anjaneeya Swami represents the “Acharyan” who crosses this Ocean by doing Rama Naama Japam, comes to Lanka to bring BhagavAn SriRama’s message to BhaddAthma (Sita Piratti) stuck in Abhaktha Sthal that SriRama is on HIS way to recuse. (OM) breakdown is அ உ ம, where ‘’ means ParamAthma, ‘’ means BhadAthma, and ‘’ means Achrayan who bridges ParamAthma and BhaddAthma. So, we do Sharanagathy on BhagavAN’s Lotus feet with Acharya grace , so we get rescued by BhagavAn SriRamam from this Samsaram.
  8. On the Side note, Vibhishna Azhvan’s Sharanagathy is very popular, where Sita Piratti reveals HERSELF as MahaLakshmi Thayar (not as BhadhAthma) who does Purushakarathvam (Recommends to Perumal), after Acharyan Anjaneeya Swami credits Vibhishana Azhavan’s pious nature (though with Ravana) during Vibhishana’s surrender to SriRama,
  9. The Asura lady Soorpanaka represents the Avidhya (Ignorance) that is covering us in this Samsaram.
  10. Soorpanakas (Avidhya) two sons’ Subhahu (Sanchita karma) & Maarichan (Prarabtha karma) represents two types of Karmas.
    • Sanchita Karma (Unlimited Never ending Bags of Karmas) that we have accumulated over many years of birth by doing Papa/Punya activities. So after Surrender (Sharanagathy), SriRama BhagavAn destroys our “Poorva Aham” (Sanchita karmas before Sharanagathy) COMPLETELY to ZERO, which shows killing SriRAma Killing Subahu
    • The “Uttra Aham” (PrarAbtha karma after Sharanagathy) represents Maarichan who is not killed by SriRama during same time as destroying the Sanchita karmas (killing of Subhahu), which shows our life after Sharanagathy with Prarabtha karmas remaining. SriRama destroying Maarichan at a later time, shows our remaining prarabtha karmas that is holding us in this samsaram is destroyed by BhagavAn which releases us to Moksham (No rebirth).
  11. So on…. And finally BhagavAn SriRama Saves Sita Piratti.

 

So the question that will arise in everyones mind is, Which slokams in Valmiki Ramayanam informs these details?. Answer is, We will Never find one slokam that describes these details One-to-One unless we actually listen to the “Oran Vazhi GuruParamparai PoorvAcharyas Vyakyanams“ blessed to us through Velukkudi Swami’s Upanyasams/Kalakshepams.

 

**************************************

Keeping these background in Mind, the “Swapadesa Artham (Special In-Depth Meaning)” by PoorvAcharyas received through Velukkudi Swami’s ThiruvAdi for 2-52-102 as follows:

 

वराह : Wild Boar (Varaha Perumal) represents “Naimithika Pralayam” means when a BhaadhAthma (each one of us in Samsaram) when reached SriVaikuntam (NO Re-Birth/Sufferings) due to BhagavAn Sriman NarayanA Krupai (Surrender on HIS Lotus Feet as I’m YOUR PROPERTY and NO ONE ELSE PROPERTY), then we are called as MukAthmas. And Varaha Perumal doesn’t Expect “Anthima Smrithi (Our Last Minute thought in death bed)”, since HE will remember on our behalf that we are Sharanagathas and take us to Moksham, as detailed by Swami in “Varaha Charama Slokam ‘Sthithe Manase Swasthisthe……..”.

ऋश्यम् : White footed antelope represents “Nithya Pralayam”, means Individual BhaddAthma’s Birth-Death repetitive cycle inside samsaram, due to the BhaddAthma claiming its Punya (White) karmas and enjoying in Samsaram, like the white footed antelope, our feet is fixed in Samsaram, WITHOUT Surrendering to Supreme Lord SriKrishna as Sarvam SriKrishnarpanam Asthu and further accumulating Paapa Karmas by NOT saying that “I’m YOUR PROPERTY”.

पृषतं : White spots antelope represents “Aathyanthika Pralayam”, means out of the 14 lokams in One Andakatakam (Andam), three of the lokams “Bhoo, Bhuvaha, Suvaha lokams” are dissolved After White dressed Brahma devata’s 12hrs (1000 Chatur Yuga) completion, so the Andam looks like Patched (Spots) with missing three lokams.

महारुरु : Black stripes antelope represents “Praakritha Pralayam (Maha Pralayam)” , means the COMPLETE 100% Absorption/Dissolution of the Entire Samsaram by BhagavAn Sriman NarayanA after Brahma’s 100 years of life span is over (No Brahma Lokam and No Brahma, No Shiva Lokam and No Shiva and son on doen the row). The Whole Samsram looks Dark (Black) with No Sun, Stars, etc…. But the JeevAthmas who did not reach Moksham in above वराह : Wild Boar (Varaha Perumal) “Naimithika Pralayam” will remain in BhagavAn SriRama’s Thirumeni waiting for BhagavAn’s next creation, so that it doesn’t waste its life in next turn by following either Upasana Maargham (Karm-Gyana-Bhakthi), Or Sharanagathy margham to reach Moksham in same birth (Piraviyin Payan Piravaamai / பிறவியின் பயன் பிறவாமை)

 

हत्व : ह (ha) represents the Vishnu Supreme Spirit/Soul which is the ParamAthma SriRama, and it doesn’t means “Killed” in this slokam context

आदाय : means Taking/consumimg, it doesn’t mean partaking meat

मेध्य : means just “Pure or holy” and not to be understood as Pure Meat. Here Pure here means, out of the above four types of Pralayam, the Pure are the “Sharanagathas” in Naimithika Pralayam.

बुभुक्षितौ : ‘Famished’ means Tremendously Hungry. The Swapedesa Artham from Tattiriya Upanishadh Brighu Valli section 10

aham annam aham annam aham annam, aham annadah, aham annadah, aham annadah, aham slokakrit aham slokakrit aham slokakrit, aham asmi prathamaja ritasya, purvam devebhyo, amritasya nabhayi, yo ma dadati sa ideva ma, vah, aham annam annam adantamadmi, aham visvam bhuvanam abhyabhavam, suvarna jyotih, ya evam veda, ityupanisat.

[“I” below means the Supreme BhagavAn SriRama]

I am food, I am food, I am food, I am the eater of food. I am the eater of food. I am the eater of food. I am the binding agent, I am the binding agent, I am the binding agent. I am the first born of the cosmic order, before the gods and the center of Immortality. He who offers me, he alone protects me. He who eats food (without offering), I, as food, eat him. I, as the Supreme Lord, overpower the whole world. I am the golden light like that of the sun. Whosoever knows this (becomes so). This is the secret teaching.

 

वनस्पतिम् : is Tree represents the PeruVeedu SriVaikuntam

 

***********************************

So for the 2-52-102 slokam

तौ तत्र हत्वा चतुरो महामृगान्

वराहमृश्यं पृषतं महारुरुम्।

आदाय मेध्यं त्वरितं बुभुक्षितौ

वासाय काले ययतुर्वनस्पतिम्।।2.52.102।।

 

tau tatra hatvā caturaḥ mahā mṛgān |
varāham ṛśyam pṛṣatam mahā rurum |
ādāya medhyam tvaritam bubhukṣitau|
vāsāya kāle yayatur vanaḥ patim || 2-52-102

 

the online simple one-to-one translations shows the INCORRECT meaning as:

[बुभुक्षितौ famished, तौ they, तत्र there, वराहम् a boar, ऋश्यम् a whitefooted male antelope, पृषतम् spotted deer, महारुरुम् a great deer with black stripes, चतुरः four, मृगान् animals, हत्वा killed, मेध्यम् pure meat, त्वरितम् quickly, आदाय partaking as food, काले in the evening, वासाय for rest, वनस्पतिम् under a tree, ययतुः reached.

Famished, they (Rama and Lakshmana) killed a boar, a rishya (whitefooted male antelope), a spotted deer and a great deer with black stripes. They partook the meat and reached a tree by evening where they rested for the night.]

**************************

Hence, the conclusion is SriRama BhagavAn is ParamAthma who came down to Earth to show us How we should lead a Pious life, can never eat Animal meat is the common sense understanding of a Satvika reader and Satvika Orator, though other people who has Rajasik/Tamasik gunas in extreme level will say Rama eat meat during to their Arrogance/Ignorance, which we don’t need to bother about them or enlighten them. Hence, this Slokam 2-52-102 incident NEVER HAPPENED in actual SRiRama Avatar. Then why this slokam was written By Valmiki, is to actually provide us the Swapadesa Artham (TRUE IN-DEPTH meaning) as detailed above and short meaning as below:

 

Famished (Extremely Hungry to get JeevAthmas for SriVaikuntam as “Aham Annadah Aham Annadah”), BhagavAn Rama (ह for हत्व) Partook (आदाय) the Pure मेध्यम् (Only Sharanagathas) out of the four pralayams as described as a varaha (wild boar), a rishya (whitefooted antelope), a prisata (spotted deer) and a mahaaruru (great deer with black stripes) and reached (ययतुः) a tree (वनस्पतिम् / SriVaikuntam) gradually (काले) where they (MukthAthams) rested (वासाय / Nithya Vaasam / Permanently in SriVaikuntam) by doing Kainkaryam / BhagavAt Anubhavam.

 

 

***********************

 

So now, we know the True meaning of verse 2-52-89 that Sita Piratti did not provide liquor & animal meat to Ganga devi, and True meaning of verse 2-52-102 as Rama did not eat animal meat.

 

 

Nirai Irundhaal adiyenudaya Acharya ThiruvAdi Bhalatthaal and Velukkudi Swami Aasirvadhatthaal.

Kurai Irundhaal adiyenai kShamikka Prarthikkiraen.

 

 

Adiyen Srinivasa (DhoddayAcharyar) Dasan

KKC Sholinghur DhoddayAcharyar-Vedanthacharyar-KumaraSingarcharyar-Velukkudi Swamigal Thiruvadigalaey Sharanam.

Swami PIllai Lokacharyar THiruvAdigalaey Sharanam by making adiyen provide the meaning with Acharya ThiruvAdi Bhalam.

UYYA ORAEY VAZHI UDAYAVAR THIRUVADI,

Kaari Maaran Swami NamAlwar Thiruvadigalaey Sharanam,

Sholinghur Amrithavalli Thayar Samedha Bhaktochithan Perumal Ki Jai

on February 12, 2020

????????????????

on February 12, 2020

Dear prabhu,

I would like to know based on which Acharya’s commentary have you quoted to justify the four different animals to represent 4 different things?

Also the objection might be raised by others that we are unnecessarily interpreting the verse to fit our siddhanta. Why are we not simply accepting the direct meaning? We’re not interpreting it like that for other verses but for this verse it looks like we’re going to a great extent to pull the meaning of the verse to fit our philosophy. I’m just speaking from the mundane scholars’ point of view.

Your servant.

on February 14, 2020

Apdi podu good going…
Srivaishnavaley Apdi Dhan
Thanakku yethamAdhiri Change Pannippa?

on February 14, 2020

Swamt,

Adiyen have a question. Why there are 3 school of thoughts for a single veda?

1. ADVAITHAM
2. DWAITHAM
3. VISHISHTADVAITAM

There can be only one right answer right?

Dasanudasan

on February 16, 2020

Swami,

Namaskaaram

In material world or in computer systems they have 0 and 1 state. (even in material world for electron we don’t have a definite conclusion if it is wave or particle).

In spirituality also vedas allow different people with different perspectives and different tendencies to approach the Absolute Truth/Supreme Lord as per their needs. it is all accommodating, that is the magnanimity of the Lord.

Adiyen.

on February 22, 2020

Thats what adiyen said hope the point is clear now. Please read above questions raised by RPD swamy on SriVaishna’s interpretations
Dasanudasan

on February 22, 2020

It was a question to RPD swamy by the way not to devareer

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2 on February 13, 2020

Srimathe Ramanujaya Namaha,

Namskaram Rama Prabhu Dasan Swami,

Regarding devareer’s query “…………..we are unnecessarily interpreting the verse to fit our siddhanta………..I’m just speaking from the mundane scholars’ point of view”

ANSWER:

There are Three Primamry Siddhanta’s

‘1) Bahyar Siddhanta : One who doesn’t accept Veda, so they till talk anything they want. Let’s leave them if they are miniscule, or correct them with our Yatha Shakthi, if they will affect the existing Dharmam.

‘2) Kudhrishti Siddhanta: One who accepts Vedas and Studies Vedas, but provide Wrong Meaning due to the Avidhya surrounding them. These type are more harmful to society, since they are not Nasthikas, rather they are Aasthika-Nasthika Combination. These needs to be fixed by the able Vaidhiha persons.

‘3) Vaidhiha Siddhanta: One who accepts Vedas and Studies Vedas and propagate the correct meanings of Purans, Ithihaasas, Upanishadhs etc… which is IN-LINE with BhagavAn SriRama’s ThiruUllam, which should be our focus, which is what Sri Velukkudi Swami and other Spiritual preceptors does. We call this type as Sanatana Dharmam.

Now within this Vaidhiha Siddantha, there are three sub categories depending up on the Spiritual Master’s lead focus as either Satva or Rajo or Tamas,

So the Vaidhiha SIddantha has been sub-classified:

         a) Rajo Siddantha

         b) Tamo Siddantha

         c) Satva Siddantha (with Rajo and Tamo at low percentage)

         d) Suddha Satva Siddantha (Pure Satvam, No Rajo & No Tamo)

 

Overall, there is 6 Siddanthas.1),2 ), 3) a,b,c,d. So when devareer say “…..our SIddantha….“, the next question that will be raised is, which is our SIddantha out of these 6 types? Adiyen follow Type 3 d) Suddha Satvam Siddantha, which adiyen believe it is devareer’s preference as well and everyone’s preference as well.

Also regarding devareer’s query on “……….Why are we not simply accepting the direct meaning? ……….”

So, the above thread explanations of verse 2-52-89 & 102 ARE THE DIRECT MEANINGS based on “Suddha Satva Siddantha” which always talks in HIGH ESTEEM about BhagavAn, Thayar, Alwars, Acharyas. Remaining other 5 Siddantha following People may write their own direct meaning which can either demean or defame SriRama’s actions”, but the Suddha Satva Siddantha people will restore it. This is how the Suddha Satva SIddantha PoorvAcharyas wrote Acharya Hrudhayam Grantham, Sri Vachana Bhushanam Grantham to enlighten the world by correcting the other 5 siddantha philosophy writings/propagations.

So there can be 6 direct meanings for these verses depending u on which Siddantha people is going to write the explanation. But we Sharanagathas should only think about Suddha Satva Perspective that SriRama is a Maryadha Purushottham (ParamAthma), and if the popular Yokika Translations says about animal meat eating, then it falls under other Siddanthas, and they have to learn how to reduce their Rajo/Tamo gunas and improve upon their “Maha Vishvasam” on BhagavAn SriRama. So, we can pray on Swami Ramanujar’s Lotus Feet for those Mundane Scholars to get better on their Satva Gunas, and fix them wherever we encounter by ourselves with our Yatha Shakthi which is what Sri Velukkudi Krishnan Swami has been doing it Polishing manner, adiyen believe.

 

This is adiyens’ understanding from Velukkudi Swami’s Upanyasams/Kalakshepams with Acharya ThiruvAdi Bhalam and Velukkudi Swami’s Aasirvadham.

 

வாளால்  அறுத்து  சுடினும்  மருத்துவன் பால் மாளா காதல்

(Adiyen wishes and prays that we all get this mind set in this birth itself)

 

Adiyen Srinivasa (DhoddayAcharyar) Dasan

on February 13, 2020

????
????

on February 13, 2020

Dear prabhu,

Thank you for your reply and explanations.

Your servant.

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2 on February 15, 2020

Nadri Rama Prabhu Dasan ‘Rpd’ Swami for devareer’s understanding due to devareer’s Acharya Krupai and Velukkudi Swami’s Anugraham ????

on February 23, 2020

ElayaAlwar Swamy
That was a great R & D explanation based on AchArya thiruvadi bhalam. This post should be publicized. Adiyen already did.

The contents are tremendous. Shuddha Sattva matter SuperO Super

MahAVishwAsam yes always required. These things can shake it. Devareer made Strong SriVaishnava pillar.

The pillar from which Narasimhar can come out. Read full article. Amazing. Really great. How much answers our AchAryAs have given.

We are so foolish to ask direct questions with unqualified knowledge but anyway , wrong question may be once a fool but never questioning will remain a fool.

Adiyen had the same question. D A Joseph Swamy the famous Sri Vaishnava Orator gave a book written by a SriVaishnava may be his guru & stated there is nothing wrong & justified as Sri Rama being a kshatriya

Adiyen had raised same question in this forum nobody answered . Kekarava kaeta dhan answer varum pola irukku

Dasanudasan

on March 3, 2020

Adiyen Charamavathi Dasan Vikram Swami for publishing Poorvacharyas Vachanams received through Velukkudi Swami’s Anugraham. Devareerukku Pallandu.

Adiyen also replied now to the multiple small posts in the above threads for BhagavAtA Abhimaanam.

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0 on April 3, 2020

Srimathe Ramanujaya Namaha,

Velukkudi Swami’s today’s graceful Enpani #1699 “இராமாயணத்தில் இடைச்செருகலா, பாட பேதமா” gives us a Big Picture of overall concept as to how differences are to be understood and judged.

Adiyen (ElayaAlwar) Srinivasa (DhoddayAcharyar) Dasan

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