Like to understand Siddhar vs Jeeyar swamy approach

Updated on April 19, 2022 in Acharyas
45 on April 3, 2022

Dear Swamy/Periyava,

Adiyen Ramanujadasan

Adiyen would like to know about Siddhar approach vs Jeeyar swamy approach!

Siddhar approach is free to reach, anytime , any mind and seek for an answer.?

Jeeyar swamy approach is discipline approach only defined way ( not known to all) , strict rules , only divine mind is allowed (if i am in confused mind ?) .

Siddhar approach is allowed only for Siva Bhakthas or Even srivaishnavam siddhar are available ( currently adiyen understood that Jeeyars who are mainly from Brahmins) ?

If valimiki/vysar are siddha purushas why we are not celebrating them like Raman maharishi/YogiRam suruath Kumar/etc…..

Adiyen experience sharing:

in the past i visited the Thiruvannamali temple for Giri vallam keeping my Perumal as only goal to achieve and requested Siva to help to reach my goal. Found the common man freedom of reaching to Siddha purushas / Ramana ashramas and Siva sannidhi and common man connectivity between Temple – ashram is more vibrant /expression in my eyes.

Adiyen visited the srirangam and felt the same divine experience and kept the goal of reaching my perumal but missing the siddha purshas connectivity and around the temples are Bhattars/Thirumalaigai’s and i fear to reach them due to discpline approach expected !

True Bhakthi is expected in both ways ! But freedom way can bring peace to mind towards true bhakti very fast or Discplined way only I have to follow rules which can force and mould my mind towards true bhakti?

Kshmikavum for asking the above questions! Adiyen neechan love to do what my acharyas order. But in my home this question raised hence asking periyava views.

Adiyen neechan
Ramanuja dasan

 
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SriVaishnava acharyas are focused on guiding the followers to go back to Vaikuntham. This requires some basic sincerity and submission on the part of the disciple. Those who are not looking for this goal do not go near the acharyas. And, because the acharyas want to make themselves available for those sincere individuals, they prefer to minimize unnecessary disturbance from those who want only material solutions to specific material problems (and not looking forward to spiritual solution to end all material problems completely). If in some instance the acharya wants to bless a disciple to get rid of some problem that is blocking his spiritual progress, the acharya does so based on the strength of his devotion to the Lord; not based on ‘sidhdhi’ powers he has got.

 

‘Sidhdhars’ are those who have performed severe tapasya and accumulated certain powers (classified into 8 kinds, collectively called ‘ashta sidhdhis’). Some people who seek material ‘miracle’ solution to their material problems, approach the sidhdhars, who use some of their accumulated powers to solve the problems. Such sidhdhars can not guide people to Vaikuntham! Can not ensure end to cycle of (re)birth! Can not provide permanent solution to all problems of material life! 

 

Unfortunately, some of these sidhdhars get enamored by the special attention they get, and they even begin to think they themselves are god! The are considered ‘godmen’!  They engage in improper activities, and sooner or later loose all the powers they had gained through painstaking tapasya!

 

 

 

Even in our daily experience, we can easily see that it takes a little more endeavor to access precious things compared to accessing things that are not precious.

Diamonds are less accessible; glass beads are readily available.

adiyen dasan.

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0 on April 4, 2022

Srimathe Rangaramanuja Mahadesikaya Namaha
Srimathe Sri Varaha Mahadesikaya Namaha
Sri Velukkudi Krishnan Swamy Thiruvadigaley Sharanam
Sri:

Swamy,
The question is good but the comparison is wrong.

“Siddhar approach is free to reach, anytime , any mind and seek for an answer.?” Is wrong

Many are not reachable and live in isolation.

Let’s define Siddhar
“The one who is attained (siddhi) or the one who is in the process of attaining (siddhi) is called Siddhar”.

What do they attain?
Ashta maha siddhis

What is the gain?
Nothing

Two stories:
Story 1 (Check the context not the facts of data)

A sishya of Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa did deep penance for years and said Swamy I am able to walk on water.

Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa Swamy said “hey fool, if you had given 50 paise the boat man would have taken you to the other end, you had wasted 16yrs”

Story 2 (Very interesting. Check context not factual dara please)

Listened in Sri Krishna Premi Anna’s upanyasam.
A Krishna bhaktha was so poor. (Forgot name). A siddhar saw his poor nature got pity on bhaktha & said “Here you hold this mantric coconut containing Ashta maha Siddh is Anima Garima chaiva lagima dhoora dharshanam Agni sthambo jala sthambo para Kaya praveshanam. Use these become rich”

Bhaktha asked “In how much time I will become small?”
Siddhar ” In no time, few seconds & you become invisible
Bhaktha: “Swamy, I had become too small musquito in one full janma, too big one elephant 🐘 in one full janma (birth life cycle).”

DO YOU HAVE A COCONUT FOR GETTING KRISHNA BHAKTHI?

asked the bhaktha. The Siddhar fell towards bhaktha’s feets and cried

“Looks like Krishna Bhakthi is greater than this. You have to give me some coconut”

Finally Krishna Premi Swamy said only one thing
“Siddhar Vambu namakku edhukku?” smilingly in sarcasm 😊

Irukkavey Irukku Krishna bhakthi

We Sri Vaishnavas should have crossed the materialistic boundaries , surpassed beyond “Kasu, Panam, Dhuddu money money”

To reach Krishna’s lotus abode as a Sharanagathan.

Our Acharyaas show the stairway to Vaikuntham

“Aanukoolyasya Sankalpa:”

Dasanudasan

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0 on April 4, 2022

Sitham pokku Sivam pokku
Sivam pokku Narayanan pokku

“Sri Rama Rama Rama ithi”
“Govindam Baja Mooda Mathey”

So lord Shiva knows this mind is foolish enough to get lost in Siddhis so he declares “Foolish Sitham”

Dasanudasan

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3 on April 4, 2022

One thing adiyen don’t like about today’s jeeyar Swamis is their “reachability”. It’s like getting appointment & seeing them.

As their dharsanam itself is their Sankalpam like lord Venkateshwara so nothing to complain.

I want all to reach jeeyar anytime and get blessing.

Just like politicians have black cats, nowadays there is always a circle surrounding jeeyar like Aadi Seshan not making them reachable.

Ennamo Ava mattum dhan jeeyar kku sondhakkara Madhiri naama ellam waste madhiri

on April 4, 2022
on April 4, 2022

agreed Vikram swamy above statement -> sometimes when we dont know the 4000Divya prabhandham or we accompany with our friends or Unfortunately with Mustache then we have been seen like “Dirty Rat” when we entering to visit acharyas 🙁 ! But ulloora manadhu acharyan divya kadaskhta aga engum.. 

on April 4, 2022

Kshmiakavum for the emotions and expressions! Feeling pity about expressing my emotions infront of Baghavathas group. Periyava thangal neratthai viryama seya virumbala with my unwanted wording, emotions. please ignore the above post. 

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Vikram swamy,

there are two sides to a coin; we can try and see what other reasons could be there for the situation you are describing.

 

BTW, I don’t understand the comparison of Aadi Seshan here. Does this statement imply ‘Aadi-Seshan / Swamy Ramanujar is keeping devotees away from Perumal’?

adiyen dasan.

 

PS: satRu kooraththaazhwaarai ninaivu koLLuvOm. If acharyan keeps us near by, to serve at close quarters is our kainkaryam; if acharyan keeps us at a distance, to do so is our kainkaryam.

adiyen dasan.

on April 4, 2022

True swamy ! namba achryaan dhaan namabla kadashiknaum. 

on April 5, 2022

“Does this statement imply ‘Aadi-Seshan / Swamy Ramanujar is keeping devotees away from Perumal’?”

Yes

ShAstram says it. I am not spinning my own stories.

He (Snake) keeps hissing in Vaikuntham/Thiruparkadal
Lakshmana Swamy doubted Bharathan

It happens

Did I ever say Acharyan stopping us? The surrounding people does that. Let us be practical. I have had enough.

If we don’t get dharisanam also it is Acharya’s fault only

Apuram na cinema beach drama park nu poiduvrlen

Yarum thadukks mudiyadhu

Dasanudasan

on April 5, 2022

There should be no “Vendiyava” or “Vendathava” to Sanyasi.

on April 5, 2022

Ashramams have become more of an organization. A saffronized office.

on April 5, 2022

Ramanujar guru vaarthai meerinaar
Neerum meeruveera?

on April 5, 2022

Kainkaryam dhan pradhAnam nobody denies.

Acharyanaiye dhandan Ida mudiyadhu nu apuram yedhu kainkaryam?

on April 5, 2022

Why are you preventing us from reaching our Acharyan? Why are you making Acharyan a showpiece?

Is he a product? Is that a hospital to have visitor timings?

You= Surrounding people

Allow Acharya to be on own

Acharyan thiruthattum neenga yaaru nadula?

on April 5, 2022

Neenga sevikka vidala na
Sampradhayam valaralaye nu yaen azharel?

Ava Ava
Ava Ava pokkula poitu pora

Expectations from devotees irukkuma illaiya?

Anga poiyum “SandaiyA” ? Nu nenachu yevan Ashramam pakkam povaan?

Konjam kuda logic illa

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1 on April 4, 2022

I have also observed even other spiritual leaders surrounded by a group, preventing others to have dharshan / discussion with the leader. Probably those people are more enthusiastic and selfish to do such action. If they have any work with their guru, they should vacate the place after the job is done, giving way for others. But they do not do that.

adiyen

 

on April 5, 2022

Well said Srivaishnava dasan Swamy

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1 on April 4, 2022

Thriukkoshitiyur sambavam “who were very eager to learn this secret meaning and explained the same in detail” -> Did ramanujar swamy shown us the Freedom approach or Disciplined approach ?. 

on April 5, 2022

Aasai udayorukkkellam
Freedom approach in the beginning
Then
Getting into discipline

LKG kids will have freedom to pinch others
As we grow, same teachers expect discipline

Dasanudasan

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Some factor or other may block us from reaching our acharyan or Perumal. The factors may be different. Sometimes it is personal convenience, sometimes it is our work,, sometimes it is the weather, sometimes it is the travelling distance, sometimes it is some unexpected events, sometimes it is some major event (like covid situation), sometimes is it other people (like those who are serving the acharyan at close quarters), sometimes it is our own stupidity (like preferring to go to places of distraction than places of spiritual progress).

The factors may be so many; it is impossible to list all those apparent reasons here. But at the root cause we are facing such situation because we deserve it. We deserve it, may be because

(i) Perumal wants us to hanker more for the association of our acharyan. (eg. the food tastes much better when we are very hungry. So, atleast once in a while it is good to fast and then have then food. Similarly, if we are readily given darshanam of our acharyan, we may take him for granted. So, Perumal may want to increase our hunger for seeing acharyan and hence He may use one of the factors to stop us from seeing acharyan.

(ii) may be we deserve because we have unknowingly committed some offence to acharyas or other sadhus, or those who are serving them. May be, we have unknowingly prevented some other bhaktha from seeing Perumal or acharyan in a past situation. And therefore, Perumal is now using one of the multiple factors to  keep us away from our acharyan, so that we get an opportunity to introspect and regret our mistake.

 

In these cases atleast, we must be fully confident that Perumal is in full control of the situation and He is arranging whatever is best for me.  Instead if we fail to introspect and keep blaming the external factors, that merely increases our chance of committing more offences and end up going to cinemabeachdramaparkyoutubefacebooktwitterwhatsapp.

adiyen dasan.

 

on April 5, 2022

So adicha thiruppi adippar Acharyan ?
It means the relationship is something else

Acharya SArva bowman ,Krupalu , dayalu has a different story to say than to what devareer typed

Of course our sins are our greatest hindrance

Naa ellaraitum sevikka hethuva irundhirukken

Na nenacha ulla poi kadhava saathirukka mudiyum but I didn’t & wont

My Acharyan was more close to me but I didn’t take advantage

“Seekram pongo kadhava saatha poraa” nu dhan solli irukken

Acharyan kanavula kuda pazhi vanga maataar
Neither Perumal on his behalf

Close quarters or distance quaters

Everyone should be allowed to reach acharyan

Person with bad thoughts & stupidity like me then only will change

No reason to change already good person

Person with moustache should go & realize
Moustache is not acceptible

Married should wear pancha kaccham

Sevikkavey vidalana this change will not happen

My relation girl asking “What is Gothram?”
“Is it a group of people?”

But they do kainkaryam to matam

Kainkaryam should not become a namesake ritual

Am sorry adiyen differ

Dasanudasan

So adicha thiruppi adippar Acharyan ?From vikraminside

where did you get this (mis)interpretation from?

on April 6, 2022

That’s what adiyen asking devareer?

Second part of devareer’s response sounding as if we all are criminals & Perumal & Acharyan want to teach us a lesson.

Why would Acharyan don’t want us?

“Perumal is now using one of the multiple factors to keep us away from our acharyan, so that we get an opportunity to introspect and regret our mistake”

Adiyen do agree. Sometimes we can’t be near Acharyan because we would have done some mistakes.

Acharyan & Perumal pazhi vaanga maataar.

That was adiyen’s point. Adiyen sorry for putting wrong words to describe it.

Acharyan mannikarthikku dhan irukkar. Not sure about Perumal. Dayai nu sollikalam. Who knows what mood he will adorn?

Acharyana sevikka vidatha peruml enna Perumal?

“Instead if we fail to introspect and keep blaming the external factors, that merely increases our chance of committing more offences and end up going to cinemabeachdramaparkyoutubefacebooktwitterwhatsapp.”

This is wrong Swamy. If i keep introspecting myself I will never go to ashram. I have done so many sins.

Velukkudi Krishnan Swamy used to say:
When one wants to clean the sins & go to GANGA water it will never happen..GANGA will clear the sin of bathing with sins. 🙏

Ashram’s sanctity will be lost because of my sins but it will remain as it is if I don’t get dharisanam

Let’s come back to the core.

A certain sect should not hold the control and preventing Acharyan from giving dharisanam.

My Acharyan had discussed personals , if adiyen wanted, can take advantage, can go inside room & say

“Ippa Acharyan sayanichukkka porar, paakara moodla illa” etc

Close the door from inside

Naan yaru kadhava close panna?

Ok pradhAna sishya panna rightu (closed circle as devareer said)

Varavan poravan Lama thAnavadhiyam pannuvaan?

Naama dhaan ashramathukkey owner enbadhu Pol behave panna kudathu.

Ultimate aim is to spread Srivaishnavam

Nobody is above Acharyan

If Acharyan wants he should be able to connect himself with bhakthas.

Sometimes I feel, the circle is restraining Acharya himself

I am sure this is happening other places too
Any wrong word adiyen said Kshamikka
Dasanudasan

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0 on April 5, 2022

1. All the devata-s watched this mind- blowing grand spectacle and spontaneously sang the Lords praise. This loud humming in chorus reached SRIVAIKUNTwHhAer, e the Lord was reclining on ADISESHA. SESHA, mistaking the resounding chant to be some threat to the Lord, hissed and spat poisonous fumes from his mouths. TIRUMAZHISAI AZHVAR describes this enchanting tale of devotion. The Lord reclines in the middle of the roaring ocean on a fire-spitting serpent-bed (Aangu aaravaaram adu kkettu, azhal umizhum poomkaar aravu NANMUCAN TIRUVANDADI (10)).

2. Acts as Bodyguard to the Lord

The mighty SESHA’S intense devotion to the Lord makes him anxious about the Lord’s safety and welfare. SESHA is well aware that the Lord is the Almighty who protects the entire universe. The Lord does not need to be protected, especially in SKIVAIKUNTA where, He is surrounded by loving devotees. Yet ADISESHA’S immense love makes him fear for the Lord’s safety.

ADISESHA: THE COSMIC SERPENT

Dasanudasan

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2 on April 5, 2022

Here I would like to mention about goshti, adiyen have observed, heard and even read here in one of the thread. Members of goshti isolate themselves from others (even SriVaishnavas) during parayanam. Well, I can understand one reason, if non-goshti member (SriVaishnavas) does parayanam with goshti, there will be mismatching in rendering and may be incorrect spellings / frequency.

Goshti members would have undergone pancha samskaram and are supposed to be knowledgeable w.r.to SriVaishnava philosophy. They do not allow even non-goshti SriVaishnavas who have taken pancha samskaram, to sit together with them. Atleast, they can be advised not to participate in rendering, but can be allowed to sit with the goshti in the same room (may be separately?). But why they are allowed to watch from a distance?.  Is the philosophy of omni presence and antaryami of Brahmam is only for reading and is not following?.

Note : Kindly do not call out the reason as Anushtanam is not followed or Perumal wish and so on. Whether one sings prabandham correctly or not, I strongly believe, He would like to listen. It is only the devotion and intention that matters and not the perfection. One has to remember that even goshti, when they began rendering, would have erred many times, learnt and then would have perfected.

adiyen

on April 6, 2022

Well said Sri Vaishnava Dasan Swamy
We need to sort this out. The preaching does not match in practice in Srivaishnavism as of today.

One Goshti mama sang “Vancha mukkurumbaam” kannula thanni vandhadhu.

Next moment during prasadam distribution event, shooed away my around 3yr old child saying “chi thalli po”

Idhu dhan umakku KoorathAzhwanum, ramanusarum solli kuduthara?

Pasuram nottru panni padina podhuma follow panna vendama?

Adhan Brahmins yarum madhikiradhilla, ut katchi poosal😂

So Goshti just became a mere recitation ceremony & nothing to be followed.

Of course we have to render maryada to the goshti.
My father will fall on road seeing goshti.

So willI do. Fall on the road.

We should not individualize people from goshti but as devareer said we should also be allowed to sing pasurams.

Fortunately even though adiyen don’t know that many pasurams but was allowed in many Goshtis.

Nowadays many mamas using Tablet phone in Goshti 😊so don’t worry we have crossed leaps & bounds.

5th Generation Perumal

I have even captured photo.

The point here is are we going to keep blaming ourselves for other’s mistakes or should we addresss the root cause of the problem?

MOZHIYAI KADAKKUM PERUM PUGAZHAN VANCHA MUKKURUMBAM KUZHIYAI KADAKKUM NAM KOORATHAZHWAN CHARAN KOODIYAPIN PAZHIYAI KADATHTHUUM IRAMANUSAN PUGAZH PADI ALLA VAZHIYAI KADATTHAL ENAKKINNIYATHUM VARUTHAMANDRE

Srimathe Rangaramanuja Mahadesikaya Namaha
Srimathe Sri Varaha Mahadesikaya Namaha
Sri Velukkudi Krishnan Swamy Thiruvadigaley Sharanam

on April 6, 2022

In my eyes, I am not magnanimous to call such person ‘mama’. I would have atleast expressed my displeasure for behaving like that with a child, through hand movements (ஜாடை). I do not respect the one who do not respect me. Individual in a goshti is not an exception to me.

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